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Less than 1,000 Words on "Photograph 51"--An Internet Chat with Anna Ziegler
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Anna Ziegler.
Playwright Anna Ziegler won a $10,000 award for her "Photograph 51," currently playing at the Fountain Theatre until May 3. After viewing the play, I decided on contacting her for a gmail-chat interview.
JJM: So how did you come to write about Rosalind Franklin?
Ziegler: I was commissioned by a theater in Washington DC last year to write a play about female scientists with connections to the DC/Maryland area. Mary Resing, who commissioned me, suggested three women -- Roger Young, Rachel Carson and Rosalind Franklin, even though Franklin had nothing to do with DC or Maryland. I wrote that play and wove their stories together. But then I decided I really was most interested in Franklin's story. Luckily, the theater graciously allowed me to rewrite the play so that it was just about her -- even though it didn't end up fulfilling their mission to put on plays that connect to the region.
JJM: So that was a different play? What was it about Rosalind that interested you? More than the others?
Ziegler: Well, her story is just inherently dramatic -- and sad. She was a woman who was so smart and capable and brave, but was also lacking another kind of intelligence -- and it turns out that sort of intelligence – social intelligence – would have helped her.
JJM: What materials did you use? Did you speak to anyone of the characters who are still living?
Ziegler: I used Brenda Maddox's biography primarily and Watson's "Double Helix." I didn't speak to any of the living characters but did speak to people who know them personally.
JJM: So you feel that was her fatal flaw ?
Ziegler: Possibly. It seems like she was a woman who needed almost to idolize a man for him to win her respect and she just didn't think much of Wilkins. I do think the failure of their relationship was the central issue.
JJM: Why didn't you want to speak with the people who are still living such as Gosling?
Ziegler: I'd love to speak with them. I still hope to.
JJM: If you did, would you change the play?
Ziegler: I don't know.
JJM: So in your play, you feel that the central problem with her at King's (College in London) was she didn't respect Wilkins?
Ziegler: That was part of the central problem, or a symptom of the central problem, which also had to do with the treatment of women scientists. Rosalind had to be self-protective, but that same quality ended up hurting her.
JJM: It seemed to me that in some ways it was justified since her work was slipped to Watson and Crick without her knowledge.
Ziegler: Absolutely, though she was self-protective before that even happened, right?
JJM: In the beginning of the play she says that she works alone, but when she decided to accept the position in America, she seemed to want to work as a team. Did you use this to signify a change in her attitude or a slight acknowledgement that she had made a mistake with Wilkins, Crick and Watson?
Ziegler: Hmm...Well, she never goes to America in the play. The lab she works at after she leaves King's is called Birkbeck and is also in London. And I think she was never, necessarily, against working with others (though perhaps her instinct was to work alone). I think, had things started off better with Wilkins, she might have been open to working with him...
JJM: For the self-protectiveness before her work was passed on to Watson, was this, in your opinion, typical of a woman working in a predominately male field or was it in part because she felt he was attracted to her?
Ziegler: I think it was her way of coping with that. And also, probably, just her way of existing in the world. In the play, she says "we are who we are" and I think that's the truth that the play posits -- that Franklin might have behaved just the same had circumstances been vastly different.
JJM: But his romantic intentions were one of the reasons?
Ziegler: I think she is prickly toward Wilkins for a number of reasons, that being one of them, yes.
JJM: Why did you decide to keep her in England? In the book, doesn't she go to America? I can't recall where she died.
Ziegler: She did visit America after she left King's, yes. But she went to Birkbeck first. I just conflated that period because I wanted the play to be mostly about the race for the double helix and less about the aftermath. She died in London.
JJM: In the end, why did you bring back Wilkins and have him cry?
Ziegler: Hmm...The play doesn't actually indicate that he should cry at the end.
JJM: Oh, how interesting.
Ziegler: But I ended it with the two of them together because I think the failure of that relationship was at the heart of their not getting to DNA first...Also, I thought it'd be interesting to have Franklin leave the stage at the end, as she did in life, by dying, leaving others to put the pieces of the story together without her.
JJM: What do you think women in contemporary society can take away from this play and what about men?
Ziegler: I think that's probably for audiences to determine! But if I were to guess, I'd think that people--men and women -- would see the play and think about their own stories, and whether or not we can change who we are. And perhaps a message of the play is to be more open to working with others and less prideful, to collaborate, to let our stories come together to create bigger, better stories. I also think, however, that Rosalind was an amazing person and I hope her story moves people and can be seen as a personal warning but also just a fascinating piece of science history and women's history...
JJM: What has been the most interesting reaction you've had to this play and/or the most unexpected?
Ziegler: Hmm...I guess I find it interesting that a couple reviewers have found Rosalind unsympathetic. I think of her as being totally sympathetic--complicated, flawed, not always nice, but also very tragic...I mean, she was so stubborn that she couldn't let herself be happy. I've been really pleasantly surprised that so many people have found the play funny and also moving. I always worry that my plays won't be moving and I think, in truth, that has a lot to do with the production, and also the particular performance. I'm always shocked to remember how performances vary so much from night to night. And that totally affects audience response.
JJM: I found her very sympathetic, but I've also worked in a male-dominated field. Last set of questions: how long did it take you to write this play and did it take longer because you wanted to get the science right?
Ziegler: I'm glad you found her sympathetic. I do too. As for how long it took me to write the play...I wrote an initial draft in about a month but then worked on it on and off for 8 or 9 months before the Fountain's production opened. I have spent more time on this play than with some others of mine because of the research, though the actual time spent writing is probably about the same.
Ziegler will be in Los Angeles on April 11 to receive the $10,000 STAGE award prior to that evening's performance at the Fountain Theatre.
"Photograph 51," Fountain Theatre, 5060 Fountain Ave. (at Normandie), Los Angeles. Thursdays-Saturdays, 8 p.m.; Sundays, 2 p.m. $18-$25. Ends May 3.
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