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I'm going to call it like I saw it, and the league can do no more than rescind my press pass. Head official Tim Weyland (follow link for another controversial match by the referee) had the worst match I've seen in years and his poor performance cost the Sounders a possible win at home on Mother's Day against the all-too-willing to flail and dive Los Angeles Galaxy.
There were rave green 'thunder sticks' littering the crowd, but it was the Sounders who got 'stuck' by Weyland and his inept crew in the end. Sounders FC head coach Sigi Schmid naturally was more measured about the officiating in his post-match comments, but not by much.
Sounders fans are talking about the Weyland nightmare in the GOALSeattle.com Forums. See video and photos from the match here.
"I’ve known the referee for a long time," said Schmid. "When I was coaching in college we were allowed to list a couple of referees who would not be put on your games. He hasn’t refereed many games that I’ve coached."
About the overall calling of the match Schmid said "There seemed to be a lot of inequalities in the game. Early on there was an injury to Jhon Kennedy Hurtado and it seemed like it took them forever to get him back on the field. There was an injured Galaxy player and he was able to come on immediately."
Prost Amerika Soccer Match Report here.
Match photo gallery from GOALSeattle.com's Jenni Conner here.
Match photo gallery from GOALSeattle.com's Rick Morrison here.
Lead official Tim Weyland gets in the middle of a fracas in which he eventually called Seattle's James Riley for a red card.
(Rick Morrison, GOALSeattle.com)
18,000 "Thunder Sticks" and one poor official for Mother's Day draw. (GOALSeattle.com)
The series of events that resulted in a red card to Seattle's James Riley and which dictated the rest of the match were of most concern to the Sounders' gaffer. "I need to see it on replay. It was our free kick and Gregg Berhalter picked up ball. I guess he thought it was his free kick. I don’t know. Maybe he was momentarily confused or dazed and the referee was confused and dazed. There ended up being a melee and a scrum. That’s about all I can say right now.The assistant referee told the referee that in his estimation it was a red or violent conduct. The other ref told him something but he chose to ignore that piece of advice. I’ll let you draw judgments on the refereeing."
Excellent use of Thunder Sticks: Emerald City Supporters construct a shout-out to "Mom."
The horrible officiating overshadowed the performances of both clubs. Seattle went ahead 1:0 on a goal by Sebastien Le Toux in the 22nd only to surrender the equalizer on a splendid header by Alan Gordon that beat Kasey Keller in the 35th. Near the end of the half Seattle's Nate Jaqua was upended in the penalty box but drew no call. A loud chorus of boos sent the officials off at the half and greeted them upon their return.
Sounders stars Kasey Keller and Freddie Ljungberg were talking officiating after the match, too. Said Keller "If we were a dirty team running around kicking people that’s one thing. I mean guys are getting sent off for silly things, where guys are getting booted in the game and not even getting yellow cards for it. So I think there are some strange, I don’t know, where something is coming from the league, or coming from the referee association, where I just think you have to realize that look ‘try to keep guys on the field’. If a guy does something nasty and punches somebody or repeatedly is kicking people and trying to hurt people, okay send them off. But little handballs and little ticky-tacky things that’s not what the game is about."
Band on the run: Sound Wave is now in the North End of Qwest Field. (GOALSeattle.com)
Ljungberg joined the chorus with "It’s really hard to say what upsets you the most. I think it’s the whole thing. Everybody knows how important the goals are. One goal would’ve changed the game. We had such good pressure on L.A. It was Nate, that penalty of course upsets you. The only thing they could really get us is when they had free kicks or did small things that weren’t small kicks and then could get out of the pressure. We really played well in the first half. I’ll leave it like that. It could’ve been a lot of goals after that. But of course it changed the rest of the game."
The Sounders have a young but growing tradition of playing hard and letting the rest take care of itself. The club has demonstrated that they aren't a bunch of complainers unless the situation is completely intolerable.
We've just experienced the first match in Sounders FC history decided by the lack of professional quality officiating.
Based on his shameful Mother's Day mess, Tim Weyland has no place in Major League Soccer.
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SEA -- Sebastien Le Toux 1 (Nate Jaqua 3, Steve Zakuani 3) 22 |
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LA -- Alan Gordon 2 (Mike Magee 1) 35 |
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Los Angeles Galaxy -- Donovan Ricketts, Tony Sanneh, Gregg Berhalter, Omar Gonzalez, Todd Dunivant, Stefani Miglioranzi, Jovan Kirovski (Chris Klein 63), Dema Kovalenko (Edson Buddle 84), Mike Magee, Alan Gordon (Eddie Lewis 76), Landon Donovan. Substitutes Not Used: A.J. DeLaGarza, Bryan Jordan, Josh Saunders, Josh Tudela. TOTAL SHOTS: 6 (6 tied with 1); SHOTS ON GOAL: 2 (Alan Gordon 1, Chris Klein 1); FOULS: 16 (Gregg Berhalter 4); OFFSIDES: 0; CORNER KICKS: 8 (Landon Donovan 8); SAVES: 1 (Donovan Ricketts 1) Seattle Sounders FC -- Kasey Keller, James Riley, Jhon Kennedy Hurtado, Tyrone Marshall, Nathan Sturgis (Zach Scott 72), Brad Evans, Osvaldo Alonso, Freddie Ljungberg, Steve Zakuani (Sanna Nyassi 73), Nate Jaqua, Sebastien Le Toux (Stephen King 87). Substitutes Not Used: Chris Eylander, Taylor Graham, Patrick Ianni, Tyson Wahl. TOTAL SHOTS: 7 (7 tied with 1); SHOTS ON GOAL: 2 (Sebastien Le Toux 1, Steve Zakuani 1); FOULS: 11 (Freddie Ljungberg 3); OFFSIDES: 4 (Nate Jaqua 3); CORNER KICKS: 5 (Freddie Ljungberg 5); SAVES: 1 (Kasey Keller 1) |
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Misconduct Summary: |
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LA -- Alan Gordon (caution; Reckless Foul) 32 |
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SEA -- Brad Evans (caution; Dissent) 45 |
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SEA -- James Riley (caution; Reckless Foul) 57 |
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SEA -- James Riley (ejection; Violent Conduct) 57 |
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SEA -- Freddie Ljungberg (caution; Dissent) 58 |
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LA -- Mike Magee (caution; Dissent) 59 |
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LA -- Tony Sanneh (caution; Dissent) 61 |
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SEA -- Nate Jaqua (caution; Reckless Tackle) 80 |
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LA -- Stefani Miglioranzi (caution; Reckless Tackle) 83 |
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Referee: Tim Weyland |
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Referee's Assistants: -Darren Clark; Emiliano Monje |
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4th Official: Yader Reyes |
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Attendance: 29,025 |
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Time of Game: 1:50 |
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Weather: Partly Cloudy-and-55-degrees |
Comments
Good stuff, David. Gotta tell it like it is.
David-
Couldn't agree with you more. My concern (and here's the conspiracy theorist in me) is that MLS has given the green light for the passing out of cards like its Christmas in order to create drama in the league.
A review is in order.
How many red cards per match in the MLS vs. Red Cards issued in EPL? Would be good to know.
Loves me Sounders, hating the ticky-tacky calls.
Wow, how do you keep me from thinking that Tim Weyland must be on the Galaxy payroll?
~S~
Conspiracy theorists all need to be rounded up and sent to Gitmo.
Over the 13 seasons of MLS, league referees have always issued less cards than their counterparts in other leagues and always tolerated more serious foul play and dissent than other leagues.
This is tends to show up when MLS players transfer to other leagues and are "shocked" when they cited for fouls and shown cards for things they didn't get called for in MLS.
It's even more evident when MLS clubs participate in international competition and they pick cards for late tackles and particularly dissent
The only 'conspiracy theory' I'd get behind is one that sees no fine, suspension or reduced usage of Weyland based on his performances this year in Dallas, LA and Seattle.
I want my MOMMY...to officiate the next match in which Tim Weyblind is scheduled. ;)
I was re-watching the replay, and I strongly disagree on the red to Riley. After Berhalter pushed down Le Toux from behind, Riley wanted a quick free kick.
As he went to get it from Berhalter, Berhalter clearly realized the foul was on him, arms in the air. Riley began to bend to take the ball from Berhalter’s feet, but Berhalter armed Riley away, picked up the ball himself, and held it in a bear-hug.
Admittedly, Riley was then foolish, pushing over Berhalter to snatch the ball… but keep in mind that to this point Riley had played a very clean game.
After he picked up the ball, Riley immediately is surrounded by 3 Galaxy players and pushed aggressively by #18, who then hooked his palm around the back of Riley’s neck.
From the sideline it would have appeared that Riley then threw a punch to the side of the head, but looking from the angle of the replay, it appears Riley only actually made the same aggressive but non-violent hand-behind the neck motion, pulling #18 to the ground. Riley then immediately backs off, but the Galaxy player acts as though he’s been punched.
Seems it should have been a yellow to Berhalter and Riley, but the ref consulted the linesman who may have seen it as a punch.
Aside from the send-off, the other thing I found incredibly frustrating is that this single incident took from 56:08 to 59:22 on the clock. This alone is greater than the 3 minute stoppage time awarded by the referee, which should have been substantially more, given the ridiculous faux-injury time-wasting by the Galaxy goal-keeper and a handful of other Galaxy players.
Instead the ref stopped play exactly at the 3 minute stoppage time mark, just as we had entered the attacking third on a promising attack.
Credit to the team though for putting on a great fight for a winning goal, despite the man down.
Michael S. How do you figure? Statistics say that in the EPL this year there were 59 red cards in 716 games...that is about one red card for every 12 games. In the MLS so far this year there are 18 red cards in 12 games...that's about one red card for every 6.5 games...almost twice the number of sending offs. Not sure if it is the referees trying to make their mark on the game or MLS trying to make the league more exciting. But it is certainly more than a coincidence.
Sorry, that's 18 red card in 120 games...hope my point is not diminished by my poor typing.
Tim Weyland Photoshop party over at Seattle Offside! Alter your favorite Tim Weyland photo however you see fit and send it to me.
Seattle.theoffside.com
(Weyland is like one of those psychopathic cops who takes the job because he likes to hold control over people. He should be banned.)
Also, I watch probably on average about one European match every week. Ligue 1, Champions League, EPL, some La Liga and Serie A. I have never seen sending offs like I'm seeing in MLS this season. Kasey's is probably always a red, but both Montero's and Riley's could easily have been yellow.
I don't get it. How does inciting fans to the point of riot with this kind of refereeing make the game safer?
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I must say i support your view. As a fan of football and not stand around and hope we can get a draw (ahem...LA Galaxy) one can't help but feel horrible the officiating and Galaxy strategy was....lets just say off putting.
The lack of consistency was astounding. There were several times when the official missed calls because he wasn’t even facing the ball! On one occasion Ljungberg was tackled quite harshly only to receive a no call because it happened behind the official’s back. Now how do you explain away officials not even watching the ball/game MLS?
It seems from what they’ve released so far this year the MLS has insisted it believes the problem isn’t their officiating, its the players and fans reactions to the calls being made (rationalize much?). OK fair enough i guess. But for a league struggling to raise its profile in this country and gain more fan interest and support such a stance certainly won’t help them achieve their goals.
One thing the MLS has proven over the years is regardless of the progress made they will always find a way to alienate the fans they seem to want so much. MLS doesn't exist simply to exist...its exists for the fans an probably more importantly their dollars. So remind me why we need to adjust to you?
Laurie:
With regard to MLS ejections, I was speaking primarily of previous MLS seasons. That being said...
Statistically, comparing the send offs between MLS and the EPL is a terrible comparison
The EPL is almost complete for this season and will play 8 more league games per team whereas the MLS season is just over a 1/4 done.
Further, EPL teams generally have twice the talent and professional experience in their role players than MLS teams do on their rosters, and that shows up, not just in the quality of play, but the professionalism shown on the field. IOW much less dissent, fewer "hack" players, fewer rash tackles from inexperienced or "beaten" players, etc.
I don't know how long you've watched MLS, but having watched players on the Fire take extended 8 and 10 game vacations because of hacks like Joey Franchino on Carlos Bocanegra and Ubusuku Abukusumo on Piotr Nowak and half the league vs. Damarcus Beasley back in the day, I really do appreciate the apparent crack down on serious foul play and actions such as elbows and tackles from behind that have the potential to injure. You'll find plenty of Fire fans whining about John Thorrington's sending off 8 or so minutes into a games earlier this week, but you won't find me or Thorrington complaining about it. Same way with Robinson's foul that lead to the PK equalizer against San Jose. When you put yourself in the position of having been beaten and you are chasing a man into the box, ANY contact is going to run the risk of a PK or sending off.
So it goes with Riley swinging his arm around the head of Magee when he's already on a yellow. Never give a ref the cause to judge your dumb actions.
It really is puzzling how fans clamor for better refereeing, but bitch to high heaven when they get it, especially in the form of better enforcement of the rules that curtail dangerous play.
MLS refereeing may not be the best in the world, but if anything, MLS players need to come up to the standard of the refereeing in MLS before we really worry about "investigations".
Michael S: Let's not confuse 'better standard of refereeing' with what we saw from Weyland on Sunday. Two different issues in the end. He lost the plot fairly early on and was unable to regain it. There is such a thing in soccer decision-making as context and intent, which of course makes the game a bitch to officiate. However, it also allows for the official to 'get it right.' Weyland was not close on Sunday, in intent or context.
I agree with David to defend such an overall terrible performance from the official yesterday is just laughable.
The possible PK and disruption of the flow of the game aside. If it were better officiating that led to all the cards and calls then that's one thing, but to this point its been well documented this is not the case. in fact one could argue that the lack of consistency in calling only led to more hostility and more dangerous challenges.
It is not better officiating when an official misses a call cause his back is to the ball, it is not better officiating when an official plays advantage but when the ball is hit into touch doesn't card or call the original foul.
Michael do you work for MLS? To assume people being upset with the lack of quality officiating because we lack a knowledge of the game is both presumptuous and pretentious.
Let's not forget this is not the first highly controversial game Wyeland has overseen this year. Guy needs to do the world a favor and go back into retirement.
Interesting how quick you all are to call Riley's mistake too soft for a red, but scream for a PK when Jaqua is soft fouled in the area. At least our whining should show a little consistency, don't you think? Riley should walk away from scrums (this is soccer not rugby, right?) and probably got what he deserved, or at least shouldn't be surprised by what he got.
The officiating was certainly abysmal but I think uniformly abysmal. I noticed Weyland's back turned to some fouls our guys committed as well as vice-versa. I think the home crowd is always a little too quick to the boo, so when something as ridiculous as 3 minutes of stoppage for a mess like yesterday is booed, who's going to pay attention?
And OT -- how the hell did the LA 'keeper end up Man Of The Match? Were they awarding for most convincing dive?? Our goal was largely thanks to him. The guy made one save! Must have been a doozy.
I agree Riley's actions are unjustifiable. You can't go after another player put you hands around his face and expect to come out of it unscathed, even if they guy is nominated for an oscar for his part in the melee.
In the end it was an unfortunate game for everyone: the players, the coaches, the fans, the moms (in particular Weylands mom, how embarassing).
The Sounders do need to work on our discipline that is not a question. But i continue to disagree that throwing out cards like candy on halloween is good for the game, the league or the fans, Whether you call it "good officiating" or not. I think the universal message is be consistent. If you are consistent early and often you don't need to throw cards around.
First of all, I have not in any way shape or form, said Weyland had a good game.
David:
How is Weyland supposed to "get control of the game" and yet stay "invisible" as some people believe a referee should do? Stern looks and strong language?
Are you advocating "make up calls"? I would hope not.
Koby:
No, I do not work for MLS, USSF or any other soccer entity other than being a volunteer coach for a church league, because no one else wants to commit to doing anything other than dropping off their kids for an hour.
That being said, I don't consider fans the best judges of refereeing, even my fellow Fire fans and their protestations of unjustified calls that get blamed off on both conspiracies about certain refs that have it out for us and supposed sight disabilities. Fans are partisan, end of story, they cannot be objective.
If you want to send Weyland into retirement, you sort of have to have someone to bring up to replace him and from my observations of some of the crews who do both USL and college games, they're no where near better and often a lot more likely to insert their "authority" on a game in the vain hope of moving up in the system.
The amount the official is forced to insert himself in a game is determined to the greatest degree by the players themselves who resort to diving, professional fouling, time wasting, dissent & dangerous play. When your actions leave it up to the referee who might be 10 yards behind the play because of a beautiful defense splitting pass, you're going to get missed/bad calls.
As for the "controversy" of the LA/Chivas game, if you think his handling of that was controversial, then that's the first Superclassico you've ever watched. Those players do not like each other and it only gets worse this year with Kovalenko on the field for LA.
As for why Seattle didn't win, it wasn't Weyland, it was your team's defense giving Alan freakin' Gordon a volume of space that can only be explained by Steven Hawking and Keller getting beat to the post.
Michael S: By making consistent, correct calls from the opening whistle. This isn't magic we are talking about, it's correctly managing a match.
Thanks for educating me on how football and officiating works. I appreciate that, especially from a church league volunteer. Its great what you do but i don't need you to teach me about football mate.
I, in any of my posts, never said we lost because of the refs nor have i even hinted at the idea of conspiracies. If you read them I am pointing out the poor officiating. Let's make no mistake about it, whether you area a Galaxy fan or a Sounders fan you can't argue that the officiating was poor at best.
To call the Chivas v Galaxy a "superclasico" I've always thought was laughable. Let's not kid ourselves it is rarely super (at least in terms of quality football) nor can you call a decade of history classic. No kidding they don't like each other they're in the same city and rivals that's why its a derby man. its great to have someone so well versed the MLS tho. You're an asset to us all.
That being said i never mentioned Weylanbd's officiating in that game specifically. Look at the body of work. TFC v Dallas, which coincidentally led to TFC's coach being fined for criticism and later him stepping down for "personal reasons"; you're "superclasico" (haha) and then this game. that is three out of the 8 (depending on your team) played by teams so far(I must admit i don't know how many Weyland himself has overseen). You surely can't put all the blame on the players, fans and media for criticizing his work in all of those games can you?
To say this is the best officiating we have so live with it is ridiculous. Why can't one strive for better or demand more? Why as a fan who is supporting this league with my time and money accept poor officiating because its the best the MLS can come up with? If the MLS ever wants to reach its goals or achieve relevance in the US its going to have to quit blaming the people who support it and go address the issue....then again the've only had what 13 years?
Mike, in the past two years I've probably watched 80-100 complete MLS games, plus a couple dozen more "let's see what's on Fox Soccer" partial games. This included things like Tyrone Marshall's leg breaker on Kenny Cooper and at least 3-4 SuperClasicos. So yes, I would consider myself a fan who's watched a lot of MLS.
About those SuperClasicos. It's not just the players' emotions running high, it's how they're managed. I've seen them run the gamut. A good referee takes control early by making consistent and unbiased calls and working with the players to help them self-manage and calm themselves down.
A guy like Weyland isn't capable of that, and the only way he can attempt to take control after he screws up is to issue cards. He's kind of like the US military in the early Iraq war days, who found themselves doing civilian crowd control with nothing in their arsenal but lethal bullets. It makes bad situations much, much worse.
You're absolutely right about what MLS has been in the past -- a league full of hackers who saw dangerous play as the only way to get the advantage. This has changed a lot since Beckham arrived; it made MLS take a look at itself from the world's perspective and crack down hard on dangerous play, to the point where, like I said, our level of ejections is double the EPL.
What I'm seeing now is that the pendulum is swinging the other way, and that players are getting sent off for things that would not be red card offense in other areas of the world.
US Soccer's defense is, "sure, notbody got hurt, but these things maybe COULD be dangerous." --i.e. Montero's elbow. Um...yeah, sure, but there's a reason that other leagues in the world don't see them as red card offenses. Weyland's brand of football is about as far from the beautiful game as you can get.
David:
Consistency is in the eye of the beholder.
Koby:
Well, someone has to, because your fandom slip is showing.
And I choose that level of involvement, simply because I don't have the patience or temper to deal with parents and or other coaches that think their progeny is the next Pele and that them being subbed out of a game is going to cost them a precious "half scholarship" somewhere. Also, no where have I said it was a well reffed game.
For all your defending of the ref not costing the game, you seem to be the only one here, and other places. And if you think Weyland is bad, you really missed out on Brian Hall. Has Abby Okalaja done one of your games yet? I can't wait for that one.
Further, I agree with you, the term "Superclassico" is nothing more than a marketing tactic, but it is what it is. Not to mention some of the racial overtones that have come out between LARS and the Chivas groups adding some fuel to that.
You mention the TFC/Dallas game, it seems to be water under the bridge for them and they seem to be better off without Carver, so his is not an opinion I put a lot of veracity in, especially when he said that MLS demanded he come back to the sidelines and that was really MLSE (TFC Ownership) that demanded that.
As to the rest of your comments, fans seem to always want better refereeing, but what the really want is harsher punishments laid down when their player is fouled and "play on" when theirs does something. They never seem to be too happy when their players are punished for doing really dumb things that leave them a man down and make it hard to break down a team that's playing for the draw.
I guess SSFC always plays for the win and never looks escape with a point on the road. Then again, we're 8 games into SSFC's march to MLS Cup, so we might just need to wait to see if that happens.
I never defended Riley or our lack of discipline and I really don't think anyone on here is advocating harsher punishments, but of course you are great at putting words in our mouths so what do we know?
I doubt, other than escaping with a point due to their drab style and our inability to clear the ball, that the Galaxy fans are much happier with the officiating despite what MLS puppet Landon Donovan would lead you to believe.
I too could give a .... about TFC and their former coach all I was saying was when you have three games only a quarter of the way through the season that leave fans looking for the closest tree to lynch you from its not all poor fan perception.
other than that im done man. read other's posts before you comment on them then you won't look like such a pretentious tool.
PS: i do believe i said its great that you volunteer, so i don't know what that was about.
Laurie:
It's good to know that you've squeezed in a couple hundred MLS games in between EPL games.
LA/Chivas has been not just charged, but brutal, especially with LA's early dominance of the series. There is not a ref in MLS that would have called this season's game any differently than Weyland.
As for your comments about the US military's policing, perhaps you need to place the blame there on the government that sent them there with nothing but lethal force options and told them they'd be expecting flowers and parades rather than the forces themselves.
Again, it's very bad statistics to compare ejections in MLS 1/4 of the way through the season to the EPL which is at the end of it's season and a longer season. It all tends to average out and it's best to judge them both after all games are played.
I can't really recall any of the ejections in MLS this season that would "never" happen in another league. Your mileage may vary, but I've also seen more than enough dissent and time wasting that hasn't been correctly punished.
As for the USSF's "excuse", I'm sure you'll be there to beg that some opponents player be reinstated because a potentially dangerous tackle, didn't injure a Sounder.
Or perhaps we can go back and review Jaqua's tackle on Segares that forced him to leave the game and miss this week. You know, it did cause an injury.
The problem with harping about getting this ref or that ref suspended is who are you going to replace them with? Are we going to import some from those fabulous places elsewhere in the world where they always make the right decision?
Good luck finding that place, because refs miss calls all the time and fans over there blame them just as much or more as we do over here.
Michael: No, it isn't. Once a ref establishes a pattern of how he/she will call the match, then it is a matter of observable record that can be reviewed to see if the established order is maintained. That is part of how Refs are 'graded.' All you do is compare tackles, close calls, missed calls, etc. Inconsistency or consistency will bear out over the course of a match for all to see.
Thanks for your incredulity. Sometimes I don't believe how much soccer I watch myself.
What I tell my family is that it probably only averages out to a couple of games a week year-round -- very easy to do when you follow teams in leagues that follow different schedules, plus Cup competitions. It doesn't (or does) help that I'm also one of the MLS editors and the Weekend Editor at a soccer website. So feel free to attack me for anyting else, but I really do watch that much soccer.
And I can quit any time I want to. :-D
Laurie, "soccer" and "too much" should not appear in the same sentence unless also used with the qualifier "never." :)
Ah, David, did I say, "too much?" Au contraire! Those words are reserved for those who are planning my intervention. :-)
I just said, "that much." :-D
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