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The health care reform bill is near passage for the first time. AP Photo
This week President Obama and Congressional Democrats are making a final push to pass health care reform. If all goes well for them the health care reform bill will be the law of the land by the end of the week. The average American could care less about filibusters or reconciliation or the various details inside the some 2,000 page bill. Instead what most care about is how the bill will affect them and their health care.
The most idealistic of reform supporters view the bill as the savior of health care in America. Some believe the bill will provide insurance to all, reduce costs, and increase the quality of care at the same time.
On the other hand reform opponents see the bill as something slightly (but not much) better than the devil himself. To them the bill will usher in a new era of government controlled health care which will increase costs and dramatically reduce the quality of care for all.
The truth is of course neither of these extremes. In truth the reform package will not dramatically affect the insurance or care of most Americans. Most of the population already have insurance and those that do usually get it from their employer. For those people reform will have little to no immediate effect as they will simply stay on their current plan. The bill (a full copy and summary can be read here) exempts current plans from most of the regulation which would take place immediately. By 2011 insurers would be required to spend a portion of premiums (85%) on actual care. Many plans already do this and those that do not would be forced to reduce their profits and administration costs (generally seen as a benefit to consumers).
In addition the most dramatic provisions of the bill (such as the individual mandate) do not go into effect until five years after passage. So those people who were "forced" to buy insurance would not have to do so until 2014. Even then they may not be effected if they qualify for an exemption or pay a small fine (around 2.5% of income).
Those that would actually "feel" the passage of reform right away would be a small but significant minority of Americans who are currently falling through the cracks of the private insurance system. Here are the provisions which would apply to these people:
(1) The act would provide $10 billion over the next five years for community health centers in places where health care services are most scarce right now.
(2) The act would immediately provide $5 billion in assistance for those with pre-existing conditions who can not currently afford insurance.
(3) After six months the plan would require health insurers to stop using pre-existing conditions as a reason for exclusion of children. The ban on pre-existing condition exclusion for adults would not happen until 2014.
(4) Early retirees would be eligible to re-purchase their employee health plan after their retirement.
(5) Small businesses will be eligible to start receiving tax credits in exchange for providing health insurance for their employees.
(6) Parents will be able to keep their children on their plan until they reach the age of 26. This will keep many college students and recently graduated college students on their parents' plan.
(7) For those who enroll in "new plans" a number of other benefits will be provided within six months of passage. Included are protections from policy rescissions, the elimination of lifetime coverage limits, and the establishment of an appeals process regarding insurance company decisions.
So that is what is really on the line in the upcoming vote for reform. Later I will be writing an article on the long term effects of passage which are much more significant than the above list.
Comments
The health care bill is not going to pass. And even the Dems know that. It's just a show at this point. If they WANTED to pass something it would have been done last summer.
And 2 other things make it worth not even paying attention to. First, if it's passed, Republicans will repeal it when they take control of the House and Senate this winter. Secondly, if its passed, and if the repeal doesnt hold, they will take it to the supreme court and have it axed due to the fine line on levying taxes where the individual mandate is concerned.
So either way, the Dems are still not only on the short plank with very little support from America, but even if they suceed, it's all for naught.
Its people like u that r holding this country back.U have somehow been given the impression that what u have 2 say carries weight & that it is the way we should all think.U probably believe that because of free speech that gives u the right to say what u want.No Im not stupid.I realize thats what it means, just because the law is there doesnt mean u need 2 use it.Just bc u can jump from a high rise doesnt mean u should.Look @ the big picture...ok, maybe YOUR in a position to afford health care,these days the majority of Americans can not.How is it,a wealthy person can put so much time & energy into starting charitys but when a bill comes along that will give people a more permanent form of help,(without feeling like a cherity case) u fight it?Its not ok for the less fortunate to receive help,only when u deem it nessecary.How about this, stop getting in the way of progress, back off and see how it goes.U dont always have to voice your opinion, just because u have one.Yes this may affect your bottom line, but step back and maybe look at it from other angles.Insurance is expensive as we all know & when there are lay offs, paycuts and well just regular family expenses, its not always possible for the average family to pay that expence.
Tim says:
"The health care bill is not going to pass...First, if it's passed...Secondly, if its passed..."
I don't even have to comment to make you look like an idiot
The passage of this illegal law would mean to the average American a trashing of the US Constitution. The denial of our civil rights. The beginning of fascist dictatorship. The beginning os social unrest like never seen.
It will not pass much less stand a Constitutional challenge.
Gee, Obama has little concern for the Constitution. He is showing it more and more.
"Josh Gerstein over at Politico sent Threat Level his piece underscoring once again President Barack Obama is not the civil-liberties knight in shining armor many were expecting.
Gerstein posts a televised interview of Obama and John Walsh of America’s Most Wanted. The nation’s chief executive extols the virtues of mandatory DNA testing of Americans upon arrest, even absent charges or a conviction. Obama said, “It’s the right thing to do” to “tighten the grip around folks” who commit crime.
When it comes to civil liberties, the Obama administration has come under fire for often mirroring his predecessor’s practices surrounding state secrets, the Patriot Act and domestic spying. There’s also Gitmo, Jay Bybee and John Yoo."
"Now there’s DNA sampling. Obama told Walsh he supported the federal government, as well as the 18 states that have varying laws requiring compulsory DNA sampling of individuals upon an arrest for crimes ranging from misdemeanors to felonies. The data is lodged in state and federal databases, and has fostered as many as 200 arrests nationwide, Walsh said."
Walrus had a typo: He wrote, "I don't even have to comment to make you look like an idiot."
What he meant to write was, "I don't even have to comment to make MYSELF look like an idiot."
Accuracy is so important.
And when the benefits of this health care bill turn out to be as big a lie as 'Abortion won't be paid for with tax dollars', what will any of us be able to do about it? Is Witt going to be held responsible?
The idiocy of the above explanations by the author of this article cannot be denied. Let us just look at two things: #5, small business and tax credits--how could a tax credit incite someone to pay for an employees health insurance? Will the tax break be higher than the cost of insurance? Will the credits last as long as the employees? Somehow I doubt this. and #6 is equally doubtful, keeping children on until age 26. Who plans to pay for this? Surely not the employer! what motivation would a young adult have for getting a good job after college and settling down and moving away from mom and dad's if he is getting health ins from them? And how many young people really even need insurance anyway?
Christine: I will just address #5 in order to prove that you are the "idiot" here. Tax credits could easily inspire employers to purchase insurance. Right now small businesses lose many productive employees to larger employers who do give out insurance. They therefore have an incentive to provide insurance. Problem is many of them do not because of the costs. Right now suppose it would cost them $5,000 dollars per employee to purchase insurance but only (by their projections) give them $3,000 in extra profits. If reform gave a tax credit of $2,500 it would then be worthwhile for them to purchase insurance for their employees. Maybe instead of name-calling and asking questions that have obvious answers you should actually try researching. The answer are there take the time to do some research rather than demonstrating your own "idiocy."
One thing I have not seen are monetary numbers on is the inclusion of illegal aliens into the health care system under this plan. With 10 Million illegals who, in the near future, will be given amnesty and become legal citizens the estimated addition to the health care system at that point would add $10 billion more dollars. There would be an increased incentive for more illegal aliens to come to the U.S.
Secondly, giving states sweetheart deals to certain states and unions I believe is illegal and anticipate that other states will be talking this to the Supreme Court.
Certainly a one sided take on things.
What about the COST of all this?
What about the impact of the new taxes on a struggling economy?
Do you know about the effect of similar tax increases in 1932 and what happened there?
What about the deceptive CBO numbers no including things like the "dr fix"
How about paying for 10 years and only getting 6 years?
Who makes the jobs, and who's getting hurt financially? ... hint: they're one in the same.
You're not an idiot as someone esle suggests, just someone with a lot to learn.
We are throwing out the baby with the bathwater and they are making more people dependent on the government dole, enslaving them, no incentivising them. At the top, they are taking away the reason to work hard, making this country more like the Bolsheviks.
No thanks.
The article is one sided in that it only talks about the BENEFITS that some may 'feel' right away. He doesn't talk about the NEGATIVE effects. If the health care bill passes, I will have to pay an extra $300 a year for my "Cadillac" health, dental, vision, prescription plan for the next 4 years until I get Medicare. That is a bummer. I work hard to pay for that plan out of my own pocket. Can anyone explain why I should have to pay an extra $1,200 for my Cadillac so that someone who doesn't have a car can have a Ford. If that isn't socialism I don't know what is.
One of the bill's provisions requires people to purchase insurance if they are not insured. If they don't purchase insurance they will be fined. If this bill passes it will be the first time Americans have passed a law that fines a citizen for NOT engaging in a particular type of behavior. Does this bother anyone other than me?
One of the bill's provisions requires people to purchase insurance if they are not insured. If they don't purchase insurance they will be fined. If this bill passes it will be the first time Americans have passed a law that fines a citizen for NOT engaging in a particular type of behavior. Does this bother anyone other than me?
Tom, what about car insurance?
Christine: Really? You're right. Young people NEVER get sick or die from illness. My brother is 21 and has been diagnosed with Crohn's disease. A lifelong disease. If he drops below a certain number of hours per semester in college he loses my parents' insurance. I don't think it would be a bad thing to cover young adults until they are in an occupation permanently with insurance of their own. However, that doesn't mean I support the bill. I don't know enough about it. From reading these comments though I am appalled that illegal aliens will be granted "amnesty". It's the same as telling a child "NO." a few hundred times and then giving in and giving them what they want. Doesn't teach anyone a thing. Good questions raised though, "Where is all this money going to come from???" Also, I am a nurse. How will this effect me?? So strange that ALL republicans and some democratic votes don't outweigh a minority of democrats. We'll find out...but I imagine it's going to be the hard way.
All the progressive nations cover all their citizens health care. I guess they are all bolsheviks. I grew up during the big depression and knew we were the best nation in the world. We could outdo anyone and anything. And we did. We won WW2 and became the greatest industrial power in the world. If other nations can take care of their citizens, why cant we? We can put men on the moon and yet not be able to take care of needy. A pox on all you crybabies houses. You sure aren't made of the same stuff your grandparents were.
We are putting so much upon this healthcare bill and saying it will solve all of our problems, yet we fail to look at the whole of society when we say "Let's bail out the lower class and help those in severe poverty". Granted, I wish that all Americans could live a life of luxury and have healthcare for themselves and their family. But we fail to look at what this healthcare will do for our working class and future generations, the most important groups in our society. We are spending the middle class' tax dollars to help those who do not work for our country and are already spending an amazing percentage of our tax dollars. If we harm our working class, we damage the majority of American consumers and damage the American economy. To follow this, we dive further into debt and leave future generations with the debt that should be dealt with now. As a young American, that is not something I want me or my children to fix. These are parallels we fail to draw alongside the healthcare bill.
All the progressive nations cover all their citizens health care. I guess they are all bolsheviks. I grew up during the big depression and knew we were the best nation in the world. We could outdo anyone and anything. And we did. We won WW2 and became the greatest industrial power in the world. If other nations can take care of their citizens, why cant we? We can put men on the moon and yet not be able to take care of needy. A pox on all you crybabies houses. You sure aren't made of the same stuff your grandparents were.
All the progressive nations cover all their citizens health care. I guess they are all bolsheviks. I grew up during the big depression and knew we were the best nation in the world. We could outdo anyone and anything. And we did. We won WW2 and became the greatest industrial power in the world. If other nations can take care of their citizens, why cant we? We can put men on the moon and yet not be able to take care of needy. A pox on all you crybabies houses. You sure aren't made of the same stuff your grandparents were.
PART 2: Is it fair for hardworking taxpayers to subsidize the 11 million illegal aliens who are living at the poverty level? And if illegals can’t get healthcare or insurance, the Dems will give them amnesty so that they’ll get subsidized by the rest of us. The fact is insurance premiums will rise, taxes will rise, and the federal govt will have control over just about everything we do because our “health” is affected by the foods we eat, the water we drink, the air we breathe, the lifestyle choices we make, and so on. Obama is a piece of crap and so are Pelosi, Reid, and every other Democrat who votes for this. If this bill becomes law, it will surely bring America to its knees.
PART 1: Ryan believes a fine of 2.5% of gross income is "small". No, it's not small and it's also unAmerican to force anyone to buy insurance. No matter what you think about this legislation, it will become the largest welfare program the US has ever seen and it is a giant can of worms. What will happen to people who have plenty of money in the bank but are unemployed? If a means test is applied to these people, they will find shelters for their money so that the govt will believe they are living at the poverty level. What about the healthy young man who chooses to pay the fine but then breaks his back and tries to purchase insurance with his pre-existing condition?
Before FDR became president the federal income tax rate for most people was around 6-7%. Ever since FDR the federal tax rate has been around 28%. Add to this state income taxes, property taxes, sales taxes, excise taxes, and all sorts of fees and surcharges on utilities, auto registration, gasoline and so on. Since FDR the US has gradually become a socialized nation, and I'm saddened by this healthcare bill because it will take even more money out of my pocket. I work my ass off to produce a loaf of bread, but the federal/state/local govts take half my loaf. This disastrous healthcare bill will force me to give the govt even more. And for what? So that more people will have an incentive to sit on their asses? I hope Obama, Pelosi and Reid get what they deserve.
I don't understand why Diane says that illegal immigrants will be covered in the new bill. If you read a summary of the bill, they are specifically excluded in both the House and the Senate bill. Where is she getting her information? Likewise, the man who said that his insurance premiums will be going up is also mistaken. Most likely they will be going down because of more competition among providers and larger groups of people being covered. Adding all those 22-26 year olds who (yes) are generally pretty healthy to the pool will also keep costs down for the group. The additional costs for the most expensive types of coverage will mostly hit unions and large businesses and don't even go into effect for years!
To katiekono Part 2: The healthy young men who don’t feel a need to buy insurance will simply pay the 2.5% fine because it’s much cheaper than buying the insurance, so you can’t rely on this group to help lower the costs for all others in the pool. ObamaCare is simply a massive welfare program that will do a lot of harm to 90% of Americans. It’s a giant can of worms that was slapped together by a bunch of leftwing lawyers who are completely out of touch with mainstream America. Either you are very naïve, or you’re just one more socialist clown who would love to see America go down the toilet.
To katiekono Part 1: It looks like you represent the Obama machine and believe that your propaganda will change the minds of people opposed to ObamaCare. Whether or not illegal aliens are allowed to purchase health insurance is moot. If an illegal alien is taken to an emergency room and gets medical care, who will pay for this? Of course it will be the taxpayer. Insurance premiums WILL go up because there’s nothing that prohibits insurance companies from increasing them. First of all, a company will increase prices if the law demands that every adult buy insurance. Secondly, having to insure people with pre-existing conditions will add more risk to the pool, and this will increase the costs to all in the pool.
Fred, yes, we won WW2, we also won the cold war and spent much of my life FIGHTING communism, why are you embracing it's ambience?
And Fred, it's not worked in any country that's tried it. Do you see Americans running to England or Canada any other nation with a Public program? I don't, but I see not one patients, but doctors coming from those nations to be FREE and make choices for themselves.
and for katiekono, the cost of PRIVATE insurance companies having to accept pre-existing conditions will raise the cost immediately for EVERYONE. The is not a bad thing, but it shold have been offset with real cost saving measures like tort reform, or buying across state line. You're statement about unions and big business only getting hit with the costs is very naive. Those costs trickle down to the consumer in the form of higher cost items and feeds inflation. And, inflation hurts the ones that you're trying so hard to protect, the poor.
Yes, we need reform, but NOT THIS REFORM!
This is not about Health Care. Its about a power grab. Amnesty and guns are next. If Dem pass bill, they welcome 31M illegals next, ensure vote for century and then take away guns.
Ryan Witt,
And who do you think is going to pay for those tax credits? they do not magically appear. You are showing your own misunderstanding of the situation. The bill is terrible, I would go so far as to say unconstitutional and illegal.
Big government does not work. Name me one program the federal government has implemented for the "greater good" that has not backfired and become a terrible institution?
Jeremy: First tax credits are actually a REDUCTION in the revenue government takes from the people. So you are against tax credits?
Second. I will name three programs. The military, the Food and Drug Administration, Social Security. I could name more but I will start with those. They are government "programs" and they have certainly not "backfired" on the American people. Social Security has always been solvent it is Medicare that is in the hole and that is only because of the other problems with the health care system.
Ryan Witt,
And who do you think is going to pay for those tax credits? they do not magically appear. You are showing your own misunderstanding of the situation. The bill is terrible, I would go so far as to say unconstitutional and illegal.
Big government does not work. Name me one program the federal government has implemented for the "greater good" that has not backfired and become a terrible institution?
Ryan,
All three institutions you mention are failed. The military (of which I am a part of) has grown beyond its intetntion; listen to Eisenhowser's speech about the threat of the military machine.
Social Security, are you kidding me? Please tell me your kidding. You realize that Social Security is going to be bankrupt right? And where is the constitutionality for Social Security? Why am I paying into the program, when I will never see one penny of the money being taken from me? The government borrowed money constantly from Social Security and is one of the reasons it is going bankrupt. Not to mention the system was put in place that the younger gens would be taking care of the older. Problem is the older gen is to big and the younger gen will be unable to support the other.
And the FDA? My dada has been in the food packing industry his whole life. The FDA is no more a good program than any of the others. How many salmanella outbreaks have we had lately? How many lawsuits are pending out their because the good ol FDA allowed drugs on the market to soon? Get the picture? Parts of the FDA are good, that I agree with, but only parts; the vast majority of it are susceptible to red tape and corruption. Better the government stay out of it.
Now as to the Tax credits. You don get it do you. if the government if creating this tax credit to defer the cost where is the money coming from to keep the programs alive? An increase in the taxes by us, that is the onlt way you generate income, because you cannot (in the current government model) eliminate the monetary abuse in the system. Which is why our founding fathers saw the need for a limited government, NOT the monstrosity that it is today.
Jeremy. All fine points.
alf's "what about car insurance" comment is not even relevant or comparible. Driving is optional. I know people who do not drive and who do not have coverage, it's their choice. However, you don't have choice here. When I was in my 20's i ran without HC insurance, just like many do today, because I couldn't afford it. Now I HAVE to have it for my own good, and I still can't afford it. It's the biggest expense in our household. I've had to drop to lower coverage because the expense went out of site.
This plan will RAISE costs. Those folks with pre-existing conditions will change the pool you're in and your cost will go up. It's a hidden tax. The items you buy will cost more because there's expense at the top of the food chain in the companies' cost of goods sold. Expect inflation from that, and combine it with the deficit this will raise.
and...Screw the CBO's numbers. They're a FARCE! They said in rough numbers, it would save 130B, but the Dr fix will cost 371B and they are borrowing 53B from Social Security, who is already broke, and I think 18B from somewhere else. That's about a deficit of 1/3 TRILLION DOLLARS!! PLEASE PELOSI, WE'RE NOT THAT STUPID!!
They are also taxing for 10 years but only giving 6 years of benefits. Figure that in, and then tell me they're not LYING THEIVES STEALING MINE AND YOUR KIDS' FUTURE!
For Fred:
Give 'em hell! You are sooo right.
Wow, a ton of lies and misinformation from Obama=devil.
First of all: don't you know that no one is CURRENTLY denied coverage at the emergency room, despite citizenship status or anything else for that matter. This is ALREADY costing you money
when hospitals up their fees and insurers up their rates. This crp about illegals is ridiculously stupid and shows that you have virtually ZERO connection to reality. Are you that ill-informed and have you no means of educating yourself?
It's incredibly ironic that all of the "failures" of government programs noted here are failures to do enough to reign in corporate America...and yet you want to eliminate any oversight whatsoever and let the money-grubbers and big business run free over every aspect of society. You would have children working in meat-packing plants and every one else working 80 hours a week for six dollars an hour. NO? Well who is going to make sure this doesn't happen?
The Social Security "crisis" is one of the greatest lies to be perpetuated in this century. There is NO crisis. Social Security will continue with very, very moderate changes IF NECESSARY. Many, many economists have pointed this out again and again, but the corporate
attempts to rid us of a program they don't want to participate in have been ferocious.
One of the cable networks did a documentry on health care around the world. The nay sayers use Great Britain and Canada as bad examples. There are hundreds of other countries including France,Denmark,germany and even Russia have health care for all its citizens.THey say we have the best health care in the world. If you cant afford it would good does it do you? You cant use it so you die.And the crybabies who say the govt. is getting too big.That is why we have elections. Vote and not bitch about something you can do something about.If you dont like your politicians vote them out.I know we still have free elections in this the greatest country in the world.
Even Rush Limbaugh wants to go to Costa rica where they have health care for everyone.
Mike, agree with you on illegals - make em legal, make em pay taxes, etc. No problem here, but seal the friggin border!
As for you ss comments, I think you're smoking something. Would you believe MSNBC maybe?
Quoted from them:
Here are facts beyond dispute:
Millions of baby boomers are nearing retirement which means more people will be taking out of the system than paying in.
In 2018, the Social Security Trust Fund estimates that it will take in less in taxes than it pays out in benefits. That's a red flag.
In 2042, according to estimates, the problem gets worse. By then, the trust fund will have used up its reserves, meaning that Social Security can only cover 70 percent of the benefits it has promised to pay.
In the next 75 years, according to estimates, the financial gap runs into the trillions of dollars.
<end quote>
Oh, I see what you're thinking... pardon me...
Now, if they get the death panels working right, they can kill off a generation or 2 of seniors by denying health services, then they could solve the SS problem too.
Wake up. This is a farce. almost 3/4 of Americans don't want this! Politicians work for US, not the other way around. This bill is enslavement no matter if you're getting or paying!!
"Small businesses will be eligible to start receiving tax credits in exchange for providing health insurance for their employees."
What good are "more" tax credits, when there are little to no profits left to take those credits? I've been a business owner for 30 years. That's right, I am 53 and started my business when I was 23. You have never owned or ran a business have you? At least not with any significant number of employees. Every time congress sticks it to business, they use this "small business credit" thing to mitigate the damages they are doing. I have so many business credits now, they could carry forward for 20 years. This bill will put me out of business, or at the least, cause me to downsize, which means layoffs.
And the FDA? My dada has been in the food packing industry his whole life. The FDA is no more a good program than any of the others. How many salmanella outbreaks have we had lately? How many lawsuits are pending out their because the good ol FDA allowed drugs on the market to soon? Get the picture? Parts of the FDA are good, that I agree with, but only parts; the vast majority of it are susceptible to red tape and corruption. Better the government stay out of it.
Now as to the Tax credits. You don get it do you. if the government if creating this tax credit to defer the cost where is the money coming from to keep the programs alive? An increase in the taxes by us, that is the onlt way you generate income, because you cannot (in the current government model) eliminate the monetary abuse in the system. Which is why our founding fathers saw the need for a limited government, NOT the monstrosity that it is today.
Fred,
We do vote. We voted people out because we did not like the way they handled war. We did not vote in the Dems to do what they are doing. There is a huge disconnect between them and the majority of the U.S. public. They believe because they were voted in that gives them the right to do what THEY want, it doesn't; like you said we are a free country. But what do you do when the people you elect do not listen the people and pass laws going against what the country wants? That is not government, that is tyranny.
Also Fred,
You talk a good game about other European countries. Good, I am glad you watched a documentary that was probably one sided. I lived in Germany for 7 years and was in Denmark, France, and most other European countries as well. Their health care is terrible if you are an older person. They only take care of the people of working age. they also pay more taxes than you can imagine. Every year in Germany the government comes to their house and they pay taxes on ALL of their possesions in their house. You want this type of system? You want to pay taxes on your computer every single year? That is the only way the system will even slightly work and again you will have to cut out care for the ones that are no longer working age.
Well, it looks like this will become law. God help us.
Tom A, you're 100% correct. I too am a SB owner, and I'm NOT hiring anyone b/c of this. But this will cause everyone to have to raise prices to pay for those that do. It's a hidden tax my friend, and the whole flipping thing is illegal. (To require everyone to have insurance.) 16,500 new IRS employees will be hired, more FEDS our dollars have to pay for! they will be responsible for a MONTHLY check of business and individuals to make sure they are complying with the law...
Let me be the first to Welcome you to the New World Order, Comrade.
Illegals pay taxes. My god it comes right out of their check when they use someones good SS#. The only way they get around paying some of the tax is that they claim 5 on children in the house hold. Very few mexicans have less than 5 kids. They pay into SS and won't be taking any money out that's why they love the little brown basterds.
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