We hold these Truths to be self-evident...
The Israeli government’s video showing their soldiers being attacked as they descended from helicopters appears to be a forgery. The primary evidence is the Israeli video is missing the ship's name, with other ship structural features appearing visibly different from the actual vessel, the Mavi Marmara. The proof is explained in the below 3-minute video; with this story developing. Additional ship details are in the second 6-minute video.
The Israeli video seems to be neither fully thermal imagery or fully low-light. Thermal imagery would mean the light colors are cooler and the darker colors warmer in the video, but faces are lighter than the Israeli commando uniforms, hair, ropes, and face masks. That evidence seems to refute a 100% thermal picture. Therefore, the missing ship name in the Israeli video indicates a forged video.
In addition, the "attacks" with pipes shown on the video would have killed Israeli soldiers; this was not reported. And any professional deployment of soldiers would deserve their scripted fate in the video from allowing themselves to be attacked and over-powered by hand-held blunt objects.
Additional professional scrutiny of the videos will, I'm sure, have more to report.
If the videos are Israeli forgeries, as I’ve written, this adds to Israel’s government lies in support of unlawful war; now by creating the world’s largest concentration camp in Gaza, and perhaps soon through war against Iran based all on "emperor has no clothes" obvious lies.
US wars are equally Orwellian unlawful. Academic explanation and documentation is in the first paper, a citizen call to action in the second. The second paper has clearly marked links explaining how all claims for war with Iran are known lies.
- Academic and professional: “Open proposal to higher education”
- Citizen and passionate for justice: “Government by dicts”
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Comments
Same ship. The sister ship MS TDI Karadeniz has two antenna domes of different shape, and different radar antennas over the bridge.
The Israeli images are night vision/infrared video which is sensitive to heat. Cold paint on cold steel isn't visible and hot heads look different.
Those flags which they showed in loving detail are on the front of the forecastle and toward the bow. The flags are on the deck below the bridge, and the Israeli camera didn't show that area.
Deception is the only way zionism can stay out of trouble. And in power.
It's too racist to stand on it's own, so it hides behind Jews and Judaism.
It's time for the US to cut the cord with this rogue state.
x
"Cathy L":
Liar. Anyone can take their night vision video camera and test that all letters are visible on metal, paper, whatever.
Given you're a liar, you're welcome to provide the photographic evidence of the MS TDI Karadeniz to prove your allegations.
Google Image Search for TDI Karadeniz. Pick a side view. Or search for both ships side-by-side. TDI Karadeniz Mavi Marmara
Look at the differences in the small domes mid-ship and in front of the forward mast, and the antennas on the forward mast.
Apology accepted in advance.
Zionism as a political thought and party preceded the National Socialist Party and Fascism by decades. Where do you think those two political groups got their ideas?
To who are still defending this criminal act . I ask you a question , when you got a ship on international water , that is going to say the moon . which is governed by moon borders which is illegally sieged(collective punishment is illegal by Geneva /UN convetions ) would you accept such piracy to those ships to happen!! who cares if the humanitarian did or not resist those pirates who were fully equipped to kill (elite comandos as been informed ) The Israeli action is unacceptable , horrible ,terrible and sickening > no point to argue on videos when the action itself of piracy is illegal and criminal .
"Cathy L":
Liar. You drop your nightvision lie when exposed then have nothing to say??? Readers: this is their propaganda playbook: always make assertions, never admit lies when caught.
For a complete analysis, you'd have to do more work; including light analysis from what sources on and off ship. Certainly full ship lighting was on and the Israeli soldiers were using light sources. This is a developing story; I'm sure there are other telling facts on the video.
No, "Cathy" liar. You're making a claim, you back it up. Provide the sites with your alleged photographic evidence of the two ships to show what you claim. This is another propaganda technique; allege evidence you don't have.
Whatever is correct: Israel's act is Orwellian unlawful and US government support for it is being an accomplice to murder.
Carl, I was giving you the benefit of the doubt, but obviously you prefer to follow the propaganda technique which you mention of claiming evidence which you don't have.
Comments here do not allow URLs, so you know that I cannot provide a link nor photos.
Google Search for TDI Karadeniz. Pick a side view. Or search for both ships side-by-side. TDI Karadeniz Mavi Marmara
There are several photos of both ships next to each other, try the shipspotting site, which appears high in the search results.
Look at the differences in the small domes mid-ship and in front of the forward mast, and the antennas on the forward mast.
George,
I used to think you were right about Israel. I still want to believe it. But, in the last year or so since the Gaza war and all the lies that were spread about their army just didn't add up.
I checked Cathy L's google search of those ships. What she says bears out to be true. It sure looks like that. Again, I am forced to look truth right in the face.
I just don't know anymore.
Carl,
Here's a question I just can't get out of my mind. If the Israelis brutally attacked that ship, committed murder, and now falsified the evidence as shown in the video here, why did they let the other five ships go? They just escorted them to Ashdod and did what they said they were going to do. It seems like two different countries. Please help
“Cathy” L, George:
“Cathy”: Liar, liar, liar: admit you lied about your allegation of nightvision video.
No, liar, YOU show your evidence. I looked at shipspotting. Anyone can google:
TDI KARADENIZ and MAVI MARMARA IMO: 0000000
That’s your “evidence”???? And how hard was that to direct people to see for themselves, liar.
George: Oh, really? You mean the above image??? Prove it. What did you see? Show it.
Readers, propagandists often “sock-puppet” their lies.
And what “lies about their army”? And how does that make Collective Punishment legal, and attacking international ships in open waters with lethal force legal??? Hmmm?
Truthsayer: Uh, if someone brutally attacks your mother, kills her, and does so in front of your family but doesn’t kill your other family members, that makes it all ok?
And doing what they say, like continuing to blockade Gaza with the list of essential items blocked as my linked previous article explains, including repairing sewage treatment that Israel destroyed, hospitals, schools?
Readers: Israel wants control over Gaza. They don’t control Hamas; who won the elections. Israel says unidentified homemade “rocket” launches are “Hamas terrorists.” Israel kills to try to control.
no, of course not and you're probably right but why would the Jews attack that one boat and not the others if all six didn't resist? I mean, they must have had a motive, right? I'm just confused. To keep with your analogy, if they're Nazis they are going to murder the whole family,not just the mother, right.
Give me an email address to send you the link Carl, Those midship domes are in fact different.
And, also in your video I looked at it again and 3min 15 secs in it pans to the front of the ship and does indeed show the flags.
Maybe whoever posted it as a fraud forgot to take that out.
Listen, I am not opposed to what you say. And with all the good work you do here I am sure you wouldn't want to be led by some propaganda that wasn't true.
Truthsayer:
Don’t lie about what I write; “Nazis” is your term, not mine.
Grow-up: not “probably right” but “emperor has no clothes” obvious that Israel’s blockade/siege is unlawful, yes? Again:
And doing what they say, like continuing to blockade Gaza with the list of essential items blocked as my linked previous article explains, including repairing sewage treatment that Israel destroyed, hospitals, schools?
And try reading my last comment: it’s about control. If gangsters (this time my term appropriate to Israel) want to use your labor in exchange for their “protection,” and you don’t cooperate, they might kill your mother. But they want your slave labor for them to take a cut. In the long-term with DU weapons, Israel might want extermination of Gaza, but your guess to motive is up to you. I’ve given you mine, twice.
What we know: Israel’s video shows no ship name and more evidence might be coming. Israel’s seige is unlawful. Attacking aid ships at sea is unlawful.
George:
Write the link(s) here and now. Do something creative, like h t t p:// w w w.whatever.com or find a phrase to google like I did.
If you have evidence of domes, show everyone. I want to see it.
And comparing 3:13 in the second video to 1:18, 2:15 and 4:30, how can you say that about the flags?
And how do you explain no ship name in the Israeli video?
FWIW, I would just like to point out that the Israeli footage is thermal imaging, not nightvision or infrared. Paint on a surface will be visible in nightvision and infrared but not in thermal imaging. The paint would be the same temp. as the surface it's on so it would show as the same shade of gray as the surface.
w w w.s h i p s p o t t i n g DOT c o m then go to /modules then go to /myalbum/then go to photo-301663-then go to TDI+KARADENIZ+and+MAVI+MARMARA
follow my "then go to's" lets see if that works
Readers, Vortex, and George:
Vortex: propagandists, like “Carol L”, make statements just like yours. Notice she lied about nightvision and is gone.
Now you make a similar claim without evidence. Prove it. Walk us through the info if you know what you’re talking about. I see facial details and clothing details in the video consistent with low-light or nightvision and not temperature sensitive consistent with thermal imagining. There would be enough ambient light from the ship for low-light, that you’re correct would read letters perfectly.
Prove thermal imaging, Vortex. Refute being able to see facial and clothing details details from the actual video.
George: you’re showing the image I already located and asked you. Google to see:
TDI KARADENIZ and MAVI MARMARA IMO: 0000000
Second and last time, George: is that your image? If so, make your case. And you’re arguing the snippet view of some flags is your version of definitive proof as identical to the Mavi Marmara?
Carl:
I don't know what to tell you. I'm just speaking from first hand experience. We have Infrared cameras, a thermal imaging camera and 3rd gen., night vision goggles. You can see facial details in thermal because different parts of the face are different temperatures. You can see details in clothing for the same reason. The body heat is transferring through the clothing. With all that said, I'm completely against what Israel did and I've seen the other fakery they've committed regarding this attack. I'm just pointing out that the lack of markings on the boat in this video isn't proof of anything.
Carl:
I also just noticed a couple other things in the video. You can see the exhaust plumes being blown down from the Blackhawk's rotors. You would only see that in thermal. Also, it's faint but when the person is thrown over the railing they hold him there for a second. Once he falls you can see a slight trace of heat left on the side of the ship. About what I would expect from being held against it for just a moment. If you put your bare hand against a wall for several seconds and pull it away you'll see the heat signature on the wall in thermal.
Readers and Vortex:
Readers: George and others continue to throw “ship” against the wall to see if it sticks; George’s photo is available where I list it in the comments and you can scrutinize his claim from that photo. As someone who teaches law I can tell you a jury would reject such a claim as BS from the photo. To extend the pun, you can't see ship from that photo.
Vortex: I don’t buy those images as thermal. Look here: h ttp://x26.com/film.htm and peruse the website of flir with military imaging. Heat readings are dark, yet hair is darker than faces. Israeli commando uniforms are all dark when passenger clothing is light.
I imagine independent and expert analysis of Israeli films are coming.
Carl:
Thanks for the link. I took a look. Actually, I think those images somewhat back up what I'm saying. There are a range of thermal imagers that show various levels of detail. I would assume that the IDF would have some pretty good gear. Also, as can be seen in those photos, some imagers show heat as black while others show heat as white. Also, the darkness of the heads and the clothing depends on the thickness. That could have something to do with it in the video, not sure. For me though the fact that you can see the exhaust really tells me it's thermal.
Vortex:
Explain this: if this is thermal rather than low-light/nightvision IDF video shows ship as light; therefore cool. Dark is therefore heat. Faces are lighter than facemasks, hair, and Israeli commando uniforms. Faces should be darker than all of those if the film is thermal.
Explain that.
Carl:
Explain the exhaust plumes and residual heat on the side of the ship from the individual being thrown overboard if it's visible light technology. Perhaps it's some sort of hybrid camera that uses both thermal imaging and another form of imaging. We have the technology and like I said before, I'm sure the IDF has the best of the best tech. Also, I noticed the interface looks similar to a thermal camera's interface with bars on the side and bottom that show temperature range. It looks like it may have been somewhat blurred out or something though.
Vortex:
If the camera is a hybrid showing low-light capacity as well, that would explain why faces are lighter than masks, hair, and uniforms, and the heat signature from the guy’s hand and assumed heat exhaust rather than smoke from the helicopter.
If that’s the case, which seems to be the strongest position at the present, then the name of the ship should appear. The evidence refutes the camera was all-thermal. If it’s part low-light, then the film is a forgery because the name of the ship would be visible.
I’m sure experts will have more to say in analysis in upcoming days. There are several videos the Israeli government claims are from this incident; one they’ve already admitted had fake audio on it.
We’ll see what develops.
Thank you, Vortex.
Well, I just wanted to add my .02 for whatever it's worth. I loved the video with the creatively edited audio. It was hilarious. Why in the world would they do that after the original video and audio was already released? There's also the photo of the "terrorist" on the Marmara holding a dagger but with cameran men all around behind him and it was taken in daylight. Oh, and the new hour long video that made it out with one of the activists in which you can clearly hear suppressed, fully automatic gunfire which would match the suppressed uzis that are seen in some of the videos. Now those Iranian ships are headed for Gaza.
Well, I just wanted to add my .02 for whatever it's worth. I loved the video with the creatively edited audio. It was hilarious. Why in the world would they do that after the original video and audio was already released? There's also the photo of the "terrorist" on the Marmara holding a dagger but with cameran men all around behind him and it was taken in daylight. Oh, and the new hour long video that made it out with one of the activists in which you can clearly hear suppressed, fully automatic gunfire which would match the suppressed uzis that are seen in some of the videos. Now those Iranian ships are headed for Gaza.
"Letting Israel investigate the attack on the aid flotilla is like letting Charlie Manson investigate the Sharon Tate killings."
If you believe that Israel has a right to exist and therefore defend itself when threatened then logic would follow that there is no need for an investigation. 6 boats. 5 comply to Israeli search before going on to Gaza. One resists, and is forced to comply. What is the problem here? And, please stop all this nonsense the author here is trying to bring about international waters. The international water argument only holds in peace time, and since Hamas admits openly making war on the Jewish State, Israel has a right to do what it needs to in open water to make its citizens safe. If not, all of the naval battles of World War II come into question.
Readers and Charley:
You’re a fascist, war and fear-mongering liar, Charley. Let’s rip-open and expose your death-loving lies, one-by-one.
1. Explain why we never need to investigate claims of War Crimes.
2. Explain why “forced to comply” is justification to reject War Crimes investigation.
3. Define what constitutes a legal war under the UN Charter and how Israel is at legal war with Palestine.
4. Refute the evidence of unlawful Collective Punishment.
5. Document Palestine’s government’s declaration of war, not a statement of Hamas’ origination in 1986 discussing “Zionism,” and include context of Hamas’ rule in Palestine of an official cease-fire with Israel.
6. Explain how homemade rockets launched over the apartheid wall shouldn’t be investigated as crimes and what evidence you allege to link those crimes to Hamas.
Feel free to make more than one posts. Without facts to support your allegations, you literally don’t know what you’re talking about.
You want facts, numbskill, here's some facts. In 1948 the United Nations created two states in Palestine one for Jews and one for Arabs. The Jews accepted and the Arabs didn't. And, instead said we will kill the Jews and take all of Palestine. They failed. Now, after all this time, they still have their proxies in the world, embodied in this guy here that writes the garbage on this page.
Let me see you refute those facts for a change.
Readers and Charley:
I won’t permit you to change the subject from your unsubstantiated original claims. Either back them up or withdraw them. From what I see, you’ll need to address all six of my questions in my previous response.
I’ll delete all other posts from you, or presumed sock-puppets, until you do so.
And here’s an academic explanation of fascism: American fascism: by political definition the US is now fascist, not a constitutional republic
Yes, so far you are an advocate of fascism and not a constitutional republic operating UNDER the rule of law.
We both know how you are skewing your questions to purposely trip me up. If you want to have a debate on the merits of Israel protecting itself and Hamas trying to kill Jews we can do that. If you want to continue to act as their shill and deny all that is descent and humane then go ahead "make my day" delete this post. You don't have the beitzim to really get into this anyway. That's clear.
Readers and “Charley”:
That’s what I thought. You have no answers because you have no facts to support your statements, only ad hominem.
Here’s the future, readers: one choice is those of us committed to facts and rule of law will guide the future. The other is your “leadership” will be propagandists pimping for fascist domination and soul-crushing policies of concentration camps, like “Charley” pimping for Gaza kept as a concentration camp with empty rhetoric of being “decent and humane.”
That’s what’s clear.
Choose carefully; you’ll have what you work for.
“Charley,” as always, I offer you a “Scrooge conversion.” Your opportunity to accept for maximum benefits is a time-sensitive offer, Scrooge.
Carl Hey look at this I found from Reuters about the US Treasury attacking Iran's Banks for terrorism !
reuters.com/article/idUSTRE65F5Q620100616
Hey Carl,
I found another possible Iran war sign looking through the news. This is on the US and Israeli warships in the Suez Canal.
israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/138164
It's from Israel news source. The USS Truman, an AircraftCarrier is there.
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