If everything goes according to current schedule, attorneys for the Second Amendment Foundation and National Rifle Association will be in court on Feb. 19, 2010 for what they hope will be a smack-down of Seattle’s gun ban in city parks and recreation facilities.
The case will go before King County Superior Court Judge Greg Canova. Currently in the “discovery” phase, according to Seattle attorney Steve Fogg, who represents SAF, NRA, the Citizens Committee for the Right to Keep and Bear Arms, Washington Arms Collectors and five local residents, the lawsuit is on schedule and he believes the case is solid.
Two key plaintiffs have had encounters that clearly erase any doubts about “standing” and one of those incidents belongs in the “You’re Not Going to Believe This!” realm. Last month, Seattleite Ray Carter visited the Alki Community Center packing a pistol and he was promptly asked to leave.
Carter requested an explanation about why he was being booted, and he got one…in writing. The note, signed by Jamieka S. Muldrow, is one of those “Exhibit A”-type documents that leave gun rights advocates rolling their eyes.
This letter is informing you that you are instructed to and must depart City of Seattle Alki Community Center campus due to the fact you are lawfully carrying a fire-arm (sic) that is licensed to you. You are in violation of the City Parks policy and will not be permitted on City Parks and Recreation grounds; Regardless of any provisions in the RCW to the country (sic), while carrying a firearm. Due to the City of Seattle strict rules and policies we have to inform you that you are restricted from City of Seattle Parks and Recreation grounds.
Carter said he stood by politely while Ms. Muldrow wrote the note. There were no television cameras hovering around, Carter was not trying to make this a media event, and the note is now in the hands of the SAF/NRA legal team.
One is compelled to wonder what kind of note would be handed to a thug who is unlawfully “carrying a fire-arm” that is not “licensed” to anyone, since it would probably be stolen property. (Hint: Firearms are not licensed in Washington State. They never have been. Criminals don’t bother with concealed pistol licenses anyway.)
Carter’s fellow plaintiff, Gary Goedecke – a Pike Place businessman – was advised by a Seattle police officer not to enter Steinbrueck Park because he was legally carrying a pistol. The officer told him that firearms are not allowed in the park.
A separate challenge to the Seattle parks gun ban has been filed in federal court. Plaintiff Bob Warden of Kent, a licensed attorney, is serving as his own counsel in that case, which has no connection to the SAF/NRA case.
SAF and NRA filed their case in Superior Court about two weeks prior to the federal challenge. Superior Court is probably where this case belongs, since it involves a regulation that appears to clearly be in violation of a state statute, and Article 1, Section 24 of the state constitution, which provides that “The right of the individual citizen to bear arms in defense of himself, or the state, shall not be impaired...” Washington adopted the original state preemption law in 1983 and strengthened it in 1985. It has served as a model for similar laws in several other states.
Naveed Haq conviction long overdue
Naveed Haq, the self-styled “martyr for Islam” who forced his way at gunpoint into the Seattle Jewish Federation offices three years ago and then opened fire, will spend the rest of his life in prison following Tuesday’s guilty verdict in his second trial.
The first trial ended with a hung jury in 2008. But at least Haq will not be getting any time off for good behavior. His violent hate crime will keep him locked up for good.
Watch anti-gunners use the Haq case to launch a new campaign to attack Washington State’s gun laws as being too weak. Wait for gun prohibitionists to exploit this case to campaign for tighter restrictions on gun shows, even though Haq didn’t buy his guns at gun shows. He bought the handguns at retail gun shops in the Tri-Cities area in the weeks before his carefully-planned attack that took the life of Federation campaign director Pamela Waechter and left five other women wounded.
Haq passed background checks, same as did Virginia Tech gunman Sueng Hui-Cho. Virginia tightened up its statute as a result of the Virginia Tech massacre.
So what?
Haq had bought three firearms in the days before the shooting. While he had spent time in several mental hospitals, Haq declined to note those hospitalizations on background check questionnaires and was able to buy the guns by legal means.--Seattle Post-Intelligencer
As we saw in the recent case of Parkland cop killer Maurice Clemmons, a convicted felon who was given a break by former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee, even people who cannot legally own firearms will get them despite every legal roadblock. Such roadblocks really only impact honest citizens. Clemmons should not have had a gun, yet he had two and took a third from one of the officers he killed, and was evidently preparing to use that gun to kill a fifth cop in Seattle, who was fortunately a little quicker on the trigger.
Naveed Haq, Sueng Hui-Cho and Maurice Clemmons prove that gun control laws do not stop bad people from doing very bad things. Pushing for even more stringent firearms prohibitions in the wake of such crimes will not undo the crimes already committed, or prevent the next Clemmons, Cho or Haq from violating existing laws against murder and mayhem.
Anti-gunners just never seem to understand that.
More from Gun Rights Examiners
Atlanta: Ed Stone | Austin: Howard Nemerov | Boston: Ron Bokleman | Charlotte: Paul Valone | Cheyenne: Anthony Bouchard | Chicago: Don Gwinn | Cleveland: Daniel White | DC: Mike Stollenwerk | Denver: Dan Bidstrup | Grand Rapids: Skip Coryel | Los Angeles: John Longenecker | Minneapolis: John Pierce | National: David Codrea | Phoenix: Douglas Little | Seattle: Dave Workman | St. Louis: Kurt Hofmann | Wisconsin: Gene German
And Don’t forget to visit:
For more info: Second Amendment Foundation. National Rifle Association
Comments
There is something seriously rotten in Seattle, the state of Washington and the Federal government when citizens and advocacy groups are forced to sue to stop crime perpetrated by local authorities acting in contravention of the law. It is the job of all those entities to enforce the law. They have not done so. Had they done so, the violators would be prosecuted. Cops, mayors and employees who have enforced what is a criminal policy in violation of state law.
Since lawsuits to get the law enforced seems to be the only avenue available there should be some for all those derelict in their duty, from cops, mayors, councilmembers and prosecutors.
Good News -- Haq is off the street (until some clown paroles him).
Bad News -- The good people of Washington State are going to have to pick up his room and board for a long time.
I am the grandfather of the 14 yr-old girl abducted by Haq and the father of Cheryl Stumbo, one of the women shot by Haq. I also have a concealed carry permit in WA and wish I could have been there to protect my kin.
Haq legally bought his weapons because, in WA, commitment for mental illness must be longer than 30 days to get you on the no-guns list, where 14 days is the US standard.
Ceasefire WA (where Cheryl is now Exec. Director) & NRA teamed up to get the WA law changed. They failed because an extreme right wing 2nd Amendment group stopped it. LET'S TRY AGAIN to keep the guns out of the hands of the crooks and crazies!
Stan Stumbo
Stan,
You make a valid point, however, more anti-gun laws will not keep guns out of the hands who should not have them. Your daughter should have had a permit and a pistol to protect herself and your grand daughter. I'm sorry for your loss, but trying to keep guns from the HONEST citizens is a bad idea. Are you willing to give up your pistol if a handgun law gets passed? You know the criminals won't, look at the crime rates in the UK since they almost totally banned handguns. It didn't work there, it didn't work in DC, it didn't work in Chicago. What makes you think it will work for the entire country?
Olaf
yup. we'll be picking up the Haq bill. That's how our judicial system works. Would NRA life member(s) (& Olaf Thunderhead)suggest we just let him go?
"Watch anti-gunners use the Haq case to launch a new campaign to attack Washington State’s gun laws as being too weak." Indeed. You gun-crazed crazies REALLY don't get it...
guns + stupid/crazy people really DO kill people...
Delightful to hear from Stan Stumbo with condolences to his entire family for the very long 3.5 years of no justice. (We're all relieved by the conviction.)
Kelly:
I'm going to relay the line of another NRA Life Member, member of the NRA Board of Directors, and rock star Ted Nugent. He said it much better than I ever could.
"We don't like repeat offenders. We like dead offenders!"
I personaly believe that "felon in posession" cases should be a capital offense. But until this country has the stones to execute people who prey on the innocent, the rest of us should be prepared to live by three simple rules.
1. Double tap to center of mass.
2. Re-assess situation.
3. Repeat #1 and #2 above as required.
BTW, If you have a problem with the way Washington state handles scum like Haq, make them change it. It is your state, isn't it?
Kelly,
I do not want to see haq incarcerated; I want to see him executed, live and on television as a warning to anyone else who thinks that they can do what he did! You “liberals” don’t get it; guns in the hands of over TWO MILLION citizens prevent crimes every year! How very “liberal” of you to fling insults when you cannot use logic to refute my statements! I will not be replying to your comments in the future unless you quit acting like a child.
Olaf
And if anyone out there isn't already a life member of Second Amendment Foundation the link is on their site at:
saf.org/default.asp?p=safdonation
I'm not a shill, I get no remuneration, it's a good organization. If you live in Seattle I'm sorry your taxes are wasted by the likes of Nickels and McGinn (who supports this obviously illegal proposal). Please think about that at the next election. -Boyd
Cocaine and Heroin are totally banned.
We see how well Prohibition works.
Don't we??
fOLKS, there is no way to keep guns out of the hands of any criminal. Define criminal! One who commits crimes. one who will not and does not obey the law. And finally, A WOLF! A wolf feeds without mercy on the sheep. Occasionally a Wolf mistakes a sheepdog for a sheep. He learns very quickly to beware of sheepdogs. One does not necessarily have to kill the wolf to stop him. However, what happens to the next victim who cannot protect him or her person?? I am a Sheepdog. I have been there and done that. relunctant to take a life I merely prevented a wolf from being successful. af ew weeks later he killed a young woman. If I had allowed him to try me, and then killed him,would not the world be a better place? A loving husband would still have his wife. A child would still have its mother. brothers, sisters, parents, grandparents would have this womesn. I knew this woman. i would not be grievng for her after all these years. Lock em up or kill them. Crimes will be reduced by the number of
It's strange that local yard birds think they can manipulate and interpret local laws that contradict state and federal laws.
The Supreme Court can side with McDonauld against Chicago. That will do nothing to stop a cop or administration from not agreeing with them and make the law abiding citizen's life miserable. Back in court we go.
DC vs Heller just entrenched the anti gun politicians for making the possesion of a firearm nearly impossible without $$$$, application delays, and approvals. Politicians dont worry me. We can vote them out. What do we do about lower court judges passing local law. They are supposed to interpret Supreme Court decisions that will be a product of McDonauld vs Chicago. But will they?
As for Cho,Haq,Clemmons and those like them. They make ropes for other than tying luggage to the top of your car.
The problem with America is stupidity.
I'm not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?
It's strange that local yard birds think they can manipulate and interpret local laws that contradict state and federal laws.
The Supreme Court can side with McDonauld against Chicago. That will do nothing to stop a cop or administration from not agreeing with them and make the law abiding citizen's life miserable. Back in court we go.
DC vs Heller just entrenched the anti gun politicians for making the possesion of a firearm nearly impossible without $$$$, application delays, and approvals. Politicians dont worry me. We can vote them out. What do we do about lower court judges passing local law. They are supposed to interpret Supreme Court decisions that will be a product of McDonauld vs Chicago. But will they?
As for Cho,Haq,Clemmons and those like them. They make ropes for other than tying luggage to the top of your car.
It's strange that local yard birds think they can manipulate and interpret local laws that contradict state and federal laws.
The Supreme Court can side with McDonauld against Chicago. That will do nothing to stop a cop or administration from not agreeing with them and make the law abiding citizen's life miserable. Back in court we go.
DC vs Heller just entrenched the anti gun politicians for making the possesion of a firearm nearly impossible without $$$$, application delays, and approvals. Politicians dont worry me. We can vote them out. What do we do about lower court judges passing local law. They are supposed to interpret Supreme Court decisions that will be a product of McDonauld vs Chicago. But will they?
As for Cho,Haq,Clemmons and those like them. They make ropes for other than tying luggage to the top of your car.
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