I just received an email from a regular correspondent:
One of my local preferred gun stores was shut down by DOJ this week. It was like a raid - they came in, shut the doors, took the entire inventory of firearms (including at least a hundred plus customer consigned firearms).
There is a notice posted on the door that says everything was seized as evidence of a crime and will not be returned until the case is resolved. If you had guns consigned to the store they took them and will "return" them after the case is resolved -
My guess is that most will never be returned. Under the kalifornia basic registration law the guns are required to be registered and the cops / authorities are under no obligation to return unregistered firearms. If you had an old or 2nd party gun that was not registered to you and you consigned it to the store such that it was taken in the confiscation - you will never be able to "prove" ownership to the DOJ satisfaction and your gun will "probably" be destroyed.
The worst part is people that came in and purchased guns in the last 10 days, paid cash and have had everything disappear. (I worked in the store to help out about a week ago and I sold 2 Sig 220's - one to a person in the service - they will come back this week and find their money gone, their guns not deliverable and the store closed)
I have not seen any articles in the paper describing or notifying the public of the closure.
I asked him the name of the store and he replied:
Contra Costa Collectible Firearms, Walnut Creek, CA 94596
It's true--there's nothing in any news article, at least that a Google News search turns up at the time of this writing. Hopefully this posting will change that.
I called their number, (925) 937-3376. I let the phone ring several times. Eventually, a message played, a female voice confirming the closure and seizure of firearms as evidence, and that they are non-returnable until the case is closed.
Those interested in getting their firearms must contact Kathi Busath, Property Controller for the Bureau of Firearms by fax at 916-274-5992, or via email at kathi.busath@doj.ca.gov.
Include: Name, Address, Zip, Phone, and description of firearm(s), including Make, Model, Caliber and Serial Number.
Please pass the link to this column on to your gun-owning friends in this area. If anyone has further information, please educate us all in "Comments," below.
UPDATE: I'm testing this sound file, below, to see if it can save some of you a phone call. It's the answering machine recording (by CA DoJ?) at Contra Costa Collectibles. So far, I've gotten it to work in IE but not Firefox (it says I need a Plug In that it won't let me download for some reason)--among my many weaknesses is an utter lack of technical skill. Anyway, if it works, fine, if not I'll be removing it... any technical expertise/advise is welcome, but please remember you're dealing with an infant here.
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| CCF Recording.wma |
| Hosted by eSnips |
Comments
I am speechless, Is CA's DOJ aware of what they are doing, or rather what the consequences could be?
-SAD
Not to be flip, but what consequences would CA face?
What specific crime was committed? The fact that weapons may or may not have been registered with California DOJ? That's a crock.
The the DOJ can roll up to any gun shop and shut it down under the guise of some phantom crime having been committed and after a year or so when the gun shop owner is bankrupt the DOJ can simply say oops! Our bad. We made a mistake, you can have the guns back now.
A class action law suit has to be filed immediately to compel the DOJ to either provide a legitimate reason for the raid or return the weapons with appropriate compensation for the loss of business and punitive damages against the DOJ. This might not be the first gun shop targeted in such fashion if it's being kept this quiet.
David, I know what I would do if my gun were taken, contact the NRA for legal advise and then contact the ATF and file a stolen weapons report just to cover my @$$.
David, to clarify, I intended to state the CA DOJ requirement is a crock.
They treat us all like criminals, don't they?
Theft-by-government is still theft. Where are the "good cops" trying to bring these thieves to "justice"?
Sounds like more jackbooted thuggery from CALDOJ!
Did they shoot the dog, too?
Let me guess. Details are being withheld in the name of--
-- waaait foor iit --
national security. (Or whatever other label that means the same thing. Take your pick.)
There. We can all go back to sleep now.
You know that old saying about those who "live by the sword"? THIS is the sort of behavior that saying covers.
Everyone calm down. This is not what you think it is. The Reader's Digest Condensed Version is:
This is not an issue due to illegalities of store operation or of its owner. The owner is going thru some personal issues and due to a restraining order, the shop needed to be shut down. I don't believe the guns are "evidence", but just "protected inventory" until a distributing FFL is found. Appears other FFLs are pitching in to help stranded customers.
I don't know the owner, but he is well-respected and not a suspect in a crime. Customers will get their items back in short order, with cooperation from other FFL's in the area.
Further discussion can be found in the "2A Politics and Laws" section of the website www.calguns.net
SteadyRock,
Not to doubt your word, but if that was the case, why wasn't that said up front. There are too many conflicting statements here. When in doubt, believe the worst. You'll never be disappointed.
[...] Contra Costa Collectible Firearms raided [...]
We all know why the D O J took the fire arms,they are scared to death of us "Tea Baggers". Maybe a politictley correct name for "gun"is needed.Maybe "TOOLS of FREEDOM" Would that maybe calm them down?
"...due to a restraining order, the shop needed to be shut down"... ??
It didn't "need" to be shut down, no matter what the "law" is. Even if you claim it did, there are ways to deal with that other than stealing the guns. Nothing the government does is ever for your own good or in your best interests, even if you believe otherwise.
B Woodman,
Why the "regular correspondent" sounded the panic alarm is beyond me. I suppose you would have to ask him (and while you're at it, ask him what the "kalifornia basic registration law" is - there is no such thing). My guess is he saw a bunch of BATFE activity and, unable to dream up any plausible explanation, immediately assumed the end was nigh.
If this were anything other than what has been stated on Calguns, the legal eagles there would be all over it as they were with Bright Spot Pawn, and Red's Trading Post. They have earned credibility and so if they tell me they have reliable information saying this was due to a personal issue, I tend to believe them. Have you visited the site for yourself? There are two threads about CCC in the "2A Politics & Laws" section.
All I'm saying is, let's all not panic like the "regular correspondent" did. Let us seek reliable information from informed sources, rather than speculate wildly based on nothing but conjecture.
B Woodman,
Why the "regular correspondent" sounded the panic alarm is beyond me. I suppose you would have to ask him (and while you're at it, ask him what the "kalifornia basic registration law" is - there is no such thing). My guess is he saw a bunch of BATFE activity and, unable to dream up any plausible explanation, immediately assumed the end was nigh.
If this were anything other than what has been stated on Calguns, the legal eagles there would be all over it as they were with Bright Spot Pawn, and Red's Trading Post. They have earned credibility and so if they tell me they have reliable information saying this was due to a personal issue, I tend to believe them. Have you visited the site for yourself? There are two threads about CCC in the "2A Politics & Laws" section.
All I'm saying is, let's all not panic like the "regular correspondent" did. Let us seek reliable information from informed sources, rather than speculate wildly based on nothing but conjecture.
PART I:
I did not panic - I was reporting the closure. Period. My comments on the potential for consigned guns to be not returned is based in my personal experience with trying to get "unregistered" guns back from the police in kalifornia.
I know the owner, Chuck Goode and I agree with comments I have seen that he is a good person, reputable, knowledgeable and a pleasure to do business with. We are personal friends, I have done business at CCFA since it was owned by Mike Chance before Chuck bought it. I have also worked in the store (for no pay, to help out)
I am a real customer not a gun store time waster - so I speak as a person who buys guns a lot - not someone who stops by to shoot the sh** once a week -
I was inside the empty store the day I reported and saw Chuck standing amidst empty cases and acting stunned and out of it as he was directing someone to fill boxes and take them out to the truck.
I am unaware of a restraining order.
(MORE)
PART II:
The wife is a real piece of work and this whole thing may be a lesson in the concept of not putting everything in the wife's name - or it could be that the wife was vindictive about breaking up the "partnership" that included the FFL. I believe it is the wife on the answering machine
Chuck hopes to re-open in Martinez but I do not know when or if it will happen. I am unaware of the true nature of any "crime" being charged for which the guns are being held or withheld.
As far as the kalifornia basic registration law - the writter is incorrect - all guns in ka are required to be registered or the authorities will not return them to you if they fall into police or criminal hands (such as after a burglary) - you and I have discussed this in the past - There is no legislation titled "Basis Registration Law" but it is required that all guns be registered - no registration - no return. Period. I have experienced it, Show me different.
I hope I have answered clearly.
All of this sounds like Bull to me.
Registered or not registered to determine who gets their guns back, Hell the dealer is required to keep a record of guns he has on consignment.
What’s wrong with that record?
As far as any restraining order goes I think all of that stuff is total BS.
We can thank the G/D NRA for all of these cockeyed disqualifiers when they decided we needed the 68 GCA.
I see KABA is still playing their register or NO comment game.
In the NY 23 congressional race it looks like Hoffman may actually win but his opponent as already voted for the anti-gun health care bill.
Voting for true 2A candidates matters
The CADoJ raids. BATF raids. The IRS even raids.
Do they think people are going to eat the evidence?
I personally don't think believing in the Fourth Amendment and due process should amount to a potential instant death sentence, but that's what a raid is.
Tolerated for THOSE drug people, now pretty much standard procedure even for MIDDLE SCHOOL FOOD FIGHTS (Chicago). Law enFORCEment: its not just a job, it's like a big video game you get paid to play.
Unfortunately, the DOJ had a legitimate reason for shutting down the store; it was not definitely not due to a domestic matter. If you had firearms in the store, they should be returned to you w/i 6 months: The firearms have been seized by the Department of Justice, Bureau of Firearms, and as such are considered as evidence and non returnable until the case is resolved.
Due to the large number of firearms involved in the case, if you would like further information regarding the disposition of your firearm it is best to contact Kathi Busath, the Property Controller for the Bureau of Firearms by fax at (916) 274-5992 or by e-mail at kathi.busath@doj.ca.gov with your name, address, zip code, phone number and a description of your firearm(s). Please include the make, model, caliber and serial number. Once the case is closed she will notify you of the process required to have your firearm returned.
We apologize for the inconvenience.
California only requires that hand guns be registered and only those purchased or imported after Jan. 1 1994. No long guns are registered in California other than "assault weapons" and there should not be any "assault weapons" on consignment or for sale in the store since these can not be transferred to a new owner.
kalifornia requires all handguns to be registered. I lost a very expensive, mint, in the box 1943 Remington Rand 1911 to the police because it was not registered to me. Couldn't get it back - it was substantially older than 1994.
Fight Islam is correct. Wife is a piece of work. Answering machine voice is definitely hers not DOJ's, and posting by Contra Costa Collectibles is probably hers as well. Owner, Chuck, is honest as the day is long. Unfortunately, wifey is doing her best to destroy him. Rest assured, customers, he will do you right as soon as it is humanly possible.
My source sent me a copy of the notice on the business--I'd repro it here, but it says nothing more than has already been written. I emailed the DoJ's Busath and have received no reply. I emailed the store and got this back:
"Well, I certainly did not post this although most of the DOJ info is correct.
It doesn't really matter what caused the closure and seizure. Lets just say that Chuck is not in control of the store or arms and everyones best bet is to contact DOJ for disposition of their goods.
Thats as much as I know.
[I decided to leave out his name--DC]
Internet Sales and Service
CCCF (unpaid friend / volunteer )"
FIT and FIN: Blame the wife if that makes you feel better. Many of us know the full story. The truth always prevails.
One Who Knows: Determining the truth of this matter is what I want to do. This affects more than just the principals involved, this is an issue of interest to the gun owners caught up, and all gun owners trying to guard against infringements. Part of the job of a watchdog press is to monitor and report government activities that affect us all, to ensure against abuse. Yet attempts to get the facts are met with silence and stonewalling.
You can't really blame people for speculating in the absence of information--especially on a topic like this. If you truly are "one who knows," email me at dcodreaAThotmailDOTcom and let's start a conversation.
I have been chastised, rightfully so, in my opinion, for allowing certain comments to stand without challenge. Comments are tricky to manage. While I have no problem deleting obvious trolls, there are times when allowing/disallowing statements is a judgment call. In this case, I allowed some to stand that perhaps I should have removed, or at least followed up with a caution.
We have seen no evidence to substantiate any bad conduct by any of the principals at CCCF, and I ask all readers to bear in mind that for all any of us KNOW, both the owner and his wife are fine people caught up in a difficult situation. Please refrain from making anyone the bad guy, and let's see what we can find out that can be objectively substantiated.
Any further comments along these lines will not be allowed unless the poster can prove it--and that probably means not commenting anonymously so we know HOW they can claim that knowledge. I apologize to anyone who feels they have been unfairly spoken of.
I am unable to find the links referred to under Calguns 2nd Amend. Could someone post?
My experience with Chuck has always been very fine, and always above board in every situation both in state and at out of state gun shows.
I would like to know the location and status of my consignment guns though.
Raymond--we can't post live links in comments, but if you paste calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?p=3346743#post3346743 after the obligatory www., it will get you there.
In re finding out where your consignment is, email Kathi Busath per the info in my column and ask.
SUPER NEWS, I have written confirmation from the California Department of Justice, Bureaw of Firearms that no charges are being filed; that a "No Charges Filed" document should be filed by the end of this week: and that the firearms will be properly released to their owners shortly.
Thank God!
Raymond--can you email it to me? dcodreaAThotmailDOTcom
I had 3 guns at CCCF on consignment. Kathi B. at DOJ confirms that they have one and I should be getting paperwork soon to initiate the process of reclaiming it. I am the original owner and bought it here in CA so I should be able to get it back. The other two guns were apparently sold prior to the DOJ action. Does anyone know how I can get in touch with Chuck to collect payment on those two guns? Thanks for any help. MarkA
Wow, just found out about this. If anyone hears of any updates please contact me: b4k4x4 at yahoo dot com.
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