After seeing an intriguing advertisement by the United States Concealed Carry Association (USCCA) in the NRA magazine America’s First Freedom, I decided to download some “free” shooting skills information.
United States Concealed Carry Association: Web marketing experiment?
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While it would certainly behoove Mr. Schmidt to get involved more with groups in his state, suggesting he move somewhere else makes little sense. Had all of us in Ohio followed that logic, there might still be no CCW law here.
The $10,000 the USCCA put up to help Buckeye Firearms Association with the heavy cost of preparing a brief for the McDonald v. Chicago Supreme Court Case is also worth considering:
(See "Buckeye Firearms Foundation and USCCA file brief in U.S. Supreme Court case" on the BFA website.)
I've been a member of USCCA for several years now (Full disclosure: I've sold articles to USCCA for their website in the past), and can honestly say that the magazine alone (Concealed Carry Magazine) is worth the price of admission, and members get a lot more.
Many people are also turned off by the NRA's marketing tactics ("why all the direct mail???"), and while I'll leave it to these groups to defend their own marketing decisions, I for one am thankful f
USCCA is not a gun rights organization or firearms training organization. There are many who do that well. What it does provide is practical information about concealed carry that most people do not get from the state-required classes in some places, or from any source in states with no training requirements. If after joining people think they did not get what they were expecting, Tim will refund their membership fees. Period. No exceptions, no excuses. It's not free, and there are plenty of free sites out there to choose from. Even so, over 43,000 members have decided it's worth staying for the benefits. Maybe that's a statistic worth including in the analysis.
No question the other organizations mentioned are worth supporting, but if you're serious about learning everything you can to be more effective as a concealed carry licensee, USCCA is an excellent source of information. Handling a firearm is the easiest part of concealed carry. USCCA covers the rest.
Dear Mr. Nemerov,
I agree with you 100%. Nothing replaces the need for live training. Books, articles and videos will only take you so far.
However, I DO think there is value in our print magazine, members website, members forum, and nationally syndicated radio show (Armed American Radio).
The USCCA consistently teaches the importance of regular, LIVE-fire training. Each issue of our magazine is packed with training center reviews & recommendations.
I'm sorry I did not receive your messages. I was in Denver for the last ten days. (We're considering moving to Colorado!)
My personal email address is tim@USConcealedCarry.com
I hope we can talk so I can clear up any problems you may have with the USCCA. We're really a GREAT group of like-minded people!
Take care,
Tim Schmidt
President - USCCA
Yeah, the group is a scam. I actually joined it a long time back and then learned that if you wanted to read the forums or otherwise participate you had to kick in extra bucks for the privilege. And his 'I'm just plain folk like you" correspondence wore thin after about the second letter from them. I find that the GOA and the JPFO are far more deserving of the support of gun owners.
My BEST investment is joining my state organization and taking advanced defensive pistol training?!! That's your conclusion to this article?!
I must be missing something here because I can't tell if you're criticizing Tim Schmidt for his marketing tactics, his non-membership in other WI associations, the info the USCCA puts out, or because he didn't answer your email and phone call right away.
Every article I've ever read from the USCCA (free or paid) has helped increase or reinforce my education as a concealed carry citizen. They hardly deserve any criticism for their services.
Instead of posting a negative article about someone a couple days after you tried to reach them ... and concluding that they're avoiding you ... why not wait a few more days and really try to reach them. You of all people should know that attempting to reach someone with one email and one phone call is a pretty pathetic attempt. Do better yourself before trying to crap on others.
The USCCA is a for-profit business (that's still legal, right?), not a political action group or Second Amendment rights organization. Nor is it a training facility.
USCCA provides practical information of use to citizens about concealed carry. The magazine is worth the full price of the membership, and is chock full of holster reviews, gun reviews, analysis of citizen involved shootings, and other practical information.
USCCA is not intended to be a replacement for joining political/rights groups (NRA, SAF, GOA, etc.) or for getting quality training. Nor is it in competition with those groups.
I wish the author had given Tim the time to respond. The author would have been well-served to seek out USCCA members and speak with them about the organization, so he could understand what it is he decided to write negatively about.
I found your article worth reading, but for different reasons than presented here so far. One, I JUST printed out Tim's latest ad for "reduced" membership prices, about 60 seconds before seeing an excerpt from your article in Stephen Wenger's newsletter. I have seen the magazine, thought is OK at least, and have talked to several members, about half of which use words my Momma didn't let me use, to describe the organization and it's "benefits". Just about the other half were totally pumped by it! Sort of strange, because almost anything I was ever part of had more "in-betweeners" than radical lovers or haters. I will probably do it anyway, because I bore and amuse easily, and it isn't that much money. I do get suspicious when ANYONE out "begs" or "bargains" the NRA (whom I am a proud Benefactor Member of. They don't do everything I like, but Momma didn't either! Frankly, MY last two Presidents were Ronald Reagan and Charlton Heston! BOTH NRA heroes!!
We will see, and let ya know!
I have been a member the past year, but did not renew. The magazine is OK, but not enough to renew for. I enjoyed the cover articles, where they would showcase a member or family, etc.
The equipment reviews were a bit of a let-down. Similar to one of the major scuba magazines, the reviews are all non-critical. They are essentially in-depth advertisements. As an example, I bought synthetic holsters for a couple of my handguns. As with most things, they had pros and cons. Shortly afterwards, the magazine did a "review" of CC holsters, listed desired characteristics, and then found that only that brand had all of them. No cons, only pros.
The regular articles dealing with some aspect of CC I found to be very opinionated, and IMHO not particularly useful.
I support a number of 2A groups that are usually at the pointy end of things. I don't have anything against USCCA, just not good enough to renew in my case. May look again later to see if they get any better.
I joined -but only after spending my primary funds on the NRA, SAF, GOA, etc. USCCA is OK. NOt 'critical' to the cause, just OK.
Bottom Line: I agree with u, Mr Nemerov. He ought to "up" his image & could if he showed just a little support for the "primary" foundations... but if he doesnt, eh. no biggie. He provides a service... no crime, no big deal. USCCA: take 'em or leave 'em. Worse out there, for sure.
I had the same experience with the USCCA as did Julian - joining is merely a teaser to dig more money out of you. In that respect, they remind me of the NRA.
I'd be more tolerant of the NRA if they didn't have their fingerprints all over every piece of federal gun control legislation since 1968. It would seem their whole playbook consists of one play: compromise with the anti-gunners! Keep it up and one day we'll wake up with the 2nd Amendment nothing more than an asterisk in the history books...listed under anachronisms.
Travis: Most of your post was good. However, your last two sentences were silly because you made erroneous assumptions in order to attempt an insult. You're welcome to try again.
I almost joined the USCCA but then I figured out what you did. He is more about making money than he is about supporting rights. I'm all for capitalism but I'm not for deceiving people to make money.
Howard, this is another example of your excellent deductive and investigative skills. Keep it up!
Why should Howard have waited longer to decide he was being ignored. If I try to engage in commerce with a business, I expect that business to respond promptly to my requests. This is one of the major problems with capitalism and the free market in this country. Consumers have become so accustomed to mediocrity that they are now willing to allow service to become lousy. If it weren't for the extremely low expectations of consumers, we wouldn't have so many mediocre businesses. This is true for all groups of business. If we wouldn't have put up with the poor health insurance companies, there wouldn't be any poor insurance companies. If we wouldn't have put up with our States disallowing competition across state lines, prices would be lower and quality would be better. If we wouldn't have put up with our Federal Representative shirking their responsibility to regulate interstate commerce, states wouldn't have been able to disallow insurance carriers from selling in all states
As my Grand Mother used to say, "If everyone liked the same thing there would be a lot of left overs."
Howard, please know that the Wisconsin Concealed Carry Association is a defunct organization whose website has not been updated since 2008, and has had no impact on OC or CCW issues.
I almost joined USCCA until I realized that there is so much on the net for free, that USCCA is kind of a joke.
Thank you for pointing out that Schmidt lives in S.E. Wisconsin. I live in SE Wisconsin and cannot CCW legally. How can Schmidt espouse illegal behavior?
Please know that another organization, Wisconsin Gun Owners (WGO) is another organization that purports to be a mainstream Wisconsin pro-gun organization, when in fact, it is one guy who writes "news" stories where he basically interviews himself. It is an illegitimate organization that, like USCCA does nothing for CCW or OC in Wisconsin.
MOLON LABE!
2A: I tried to interview people from all the sites still on the net. I did interview somebody who was one of the WI Concealed Carry leaders. We know that Schmidt did not participate while this person was involved, while the group was active. WI Gun Owners didn’t respond. I guess that leaves WI-FORCE to work on concealed carry. That’s all I know. Thanks for the update.
I'm a fellow capitalist and businessman. Several decades older than Mr. Schmidt. I like to think that all these decades of business and living have removed every gullible bone from my body. I've been a member of the USCCA for about two years, first as an online only member, then I upgraded my membership to the print magazine. I receive more than my money's worth from the magazine alone. The online forums are frosting on the cake, and a fine frosting they are.
The online fellowship, mutual advice, and first person experiences are, in my opinion, well worth the expenditure of my limited time and money. As one of the relatively few California CCW permit holders, I find the USCCA online community a great asset. Mr. Schmidt must be doing something right for the USCCA has more members than the number of CCW permit holders in the entire state of California.
Mr. Nemerov, as an understanding capitalist, I fully understand the goal of any successful newspaper is to turn a profit for
Continued: (This comment section seems to truncate my posts)
Mr. Nemerov, as an understanding capitalist, I fully understand the goal of any successful newspaper is to turn a profit for it's shareholders. To turn that profit one must attract readers through articles that are intriguing, interesting and, if possible, contain some measure of controversy. You seem to have meet those criteria. I think you might form a more balanced opinion of the USCCA, and especially its online community, by becoming a member and spending a little time online with us. Other than your time, this is a no risk investment on your part, as Tim Schmidt will fully reimburse you if you are not satisfied with your membership. If you are a CCW holder, I believe you will benefit greatly from a membership in this community. If you do not yet have a CCW, you may elect to do so, assuming your home town or county will allow you to do so.
Thank you for the opportunity to post my view.
This guy is nothing more than a marketer who stumbled onto an untapped niche to make his fortune.
Read and listen to this interview and you'll understand that his passion is marketing websites, not the 2nd Amendment.
www.tinyurl.com/mkoq59
Scott,
You know why some people are very upset about the USCCA and Tim Schmidt?
I'll tell you why. It's because the USCCA is just a name that Tim admits that he just made up in order to promote his for-profit enterprise.
That's right - the United States Concealed Carry Association is simply a name that Tim fabricated in order to hawk his membership website. Nothing more - or less. And he's said as much publicly (in marketing webinars and seminars) as well.
And that's what p*sses people off the most. Nowhere does he say that the USCCA is a for-profit organization. He leaves it to your imagination to decide for yourself whether the value you get out of joining his site is worth enriching him in the process.
Tim has also revealed (in various marketing workshops and related venues) that he earned over $2.4 million last year running various websites, with most of it from the USCCA. Bully for him.
I'm all for capitalism. But bamboozling your customers isn't the best way to
Scott: Most of your commentary was great. However, calling somebody a bigot because they don't agree with you simply indicates you haven't pulled the log out of your own eye first.
The "You should join before judging" line is specious. Does this mean I can't write about how gun control is bigotry because I'm not Black or a member of the Brady Campaign?
You are welcome to try again.
Dave,
You saying that Tim has to broadcast that he makes money if you join the USCCA is like Google having to tell you that they will make money every time you click a blue link after you search...or Mr. Nemerov telling you that if you click one of those advertisements in the right column, this site makes money.
Your argument is infantile because Tim never claimed that he was a non-profit, and just because something is an association, doesn't automatically require them to not make money.
And Mr. Nemerov, I did not call you a bigot. Re-read that comment please. You can write about whatever you choose to write about, but when you imply that the USCCA is claiming to be an alternative to live training, rather than what it actually is, a resource for concealed carry knowledge, it would do you well to join and get your 'facts' straight.
Scott: I have no problem with Schmidt making money. I have a problem when people ignore the fact that about 50% of the feedback on USCCA is negative, then turning around and accuse me of bias. Please read my conclusion. With all that input, plus the private message to me, it looks like there’s a valid issue worth discussing.
Also, I have seen nothing to indicate that your “knowledge” is available only at USCCA. Are you implying that all the millions of concealed carry licensees are in danger because they don’t have your inside knowledge. Sounds like a cult to me. Marketers know that once people buy a product, they have to believe they made the right decision, and exploit this trait for further sales.
PS-You’re still using the cultist’s “you have to join to understand” mantra. So I ask again, do I have to join the Brady Campaign before I can write another article on gun control?
My wife and I live in a small town in Texas.
We had a neighbor come to our house and almost knock the door down trying to get us to the door. He was cursing and talking so loud we couldn't get a word in edge-wise stating we had told someone he was a thief.
I called the police and tried to make a report on his action, they did not make the report.
One week later I was coming out of our house trying to tell him the car he was trying to sale was already sold.
He hollered at me and told me to go in the house and shut my!&### mouth.
Again I called the police and they told me to just go in the house and let him go about his business. At this time they told me no report of the previous happening was found.
We have two drug houses less than 100 yards from us and he visits them regularly, We are afraid this is the next home invasion waiting to happen.
Wonder who the police will arrest if he invades our house.
I am a member of USCCA and hold a Concealed Carry Permit this the police are a
The USCCAA is Knowledge. Knowledge as we all know is power. The more you know the better off you are. If you are like me and have worried about the legal implications of defending yourself in this litigious society, then knowing the legal rules of deadly engagement are priceless. $97 a year for a platinum membership to the USCCAA, 10 years, $970.........you ever hire a lawyer? $200 an hour if your lucky. How many hours do you think your lawyer will charge for a 2nd degree murder trial? Even at 20 charged hours your looking $4,000 !!!!!! And i guarantee it will take more the 20 defense hours. If you know you've done everything by the book it will all work out, if you miss just one step, your possibly going to jail.
The USCCA gives you the knowledge, it is the knowledge of that split second that makes you the one thats dead, or the one thats alive, or the one that's in jail or out of jail.
Just like at the range, practicing with your gun, gaining muscle memory, that split second you gain to get you piece out of its holster, and your safety off may save your life. The information from the USCCA does the same thing, you know the law, you've read it and went over it in your mind. You don't have to think "will I go to jail for this?", you just react. An extra second. An extra SPLIT second. That could be the difference, you, or him. I think I'd like to be on the safe side.
The USCCAA is Knowledge. Knowledge as we all know is power. The more you know the better off you are. If you are like me and have worried about the legal implications of defending yourself in this litigious society, then knowing the legal rules of deadly engagement are priceless. $97 a year for a platinum membership to the USCCAA, 10 years, $970.........you ever hire a lawyer? $200 an hour if your lucky. How many hours do you think your lawyer will charge for a 2nd degree murder trial? Even at 20 charged hours your looking $4,000 !!!!!! And i guarantee it will take more the 20 defense hours. If you know you've done everything by the book it will all work out, if you miss just one step, your possibly going to jail.
The USCCA gives you the knowledge, it is the knowledge of that split second that makes you the one thats dead, or the one thats alive, or the one that's in jail or out of jail.
Just like at the range, practicing with your gun, gaining muscle memory, that split second you gain to get you piece out of its holster, and your safety off may save your life. The information from the USCCA does the same thing, you know the law, you've read it and went over it in your mind. You don't have to think "will I go to jail for this?", you just react. An extra second. An extra SPLIT second. That could be the difference, you, or him. I think I'd like to be on the safe side.
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