J-Rich: Still loved
I received tons of feedback regarding my post about how trading Jason Richardson was a mistake. They seem to be running about 60-40 against. More important is that it’s still obvious that J-Rich is missed and respected around here.
I’d like to respond to a few of the criticisms and complaints. And by the way, the comments were excellent. Just real good stuff.
GENERAL COMMENT OR COMPLAINT: If the Warriors had Richardson last season, Monta Ellis wouldn’t have blown up and become the player he became; Richardson would have halted Ellis’ development.
REBUTTAL: Some are forgetting that the starting five for the Warriors during the latter half of the 2006-07 season was: Baron Davis, Ellis, Richardson, Stephen Jackson and Al Harrington.
In other words, you could make a case that Richardson helped Ellis’ development _ by playing the small forward position. Ellis also won the NBA's Most Improved Player award with Richardson on the roster.
Monta/J-Rich combo works
GENERAL COMMENT OR COMPLAINT: Richardson was too limited of a player to be getting the money he was getting.
REBUTTAL: C'mon. Corey Maggette is too limited of a player to be getting what he’s getting; Andris Biedrins is too limited of a player to be getting what he’s getting. You can play that game all day. And who knows? You might be saying it about Ellis.
As I stated in my post, Richardson’s inability to create and handle was a killer. But if you’re going to criticize him for that (and I did) you must acknowledge that he created another way _ by getting double-teamed in the low post. That’s how he went about his creating.
GENERAL COMMENT OR COMPLAINT: Writing “Fair enough” to the idea that trading Richardson “allowed” the Warriors to re-sign Ellis and Biedrins is insufficient analysis and not acknowledging a significant part of the trade.
REBUTTAL: Let me tell you why I wrote “Fair enough,” and glossed over that particular issue. I was actually doing the other side of the argument a favor by giving you that one. But it is not a strong argument.
By rationalizing that trading Richardson "allowed" you to keep Ellis and Biedrins you’re forgetting why the Warriors said they had to make the deal: Because their cap situation needed fixing and going over the luxury tax has never been an option.
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What kind of banana is Brandan?
So, I don’t think you can claim that as a positive aspect of the trade and yet ignore the preceding signings, trades, etc., that put the Warriors in the positon they say they were in.
You can, however, make a case that by trading Richardson it put the Warriors back at Ground Zero financially. Trading Richardson wasn't the only way to get there.
The Warriors might have fans believe that they HAD to trade Richardson to keep Ellis and Biedrins, but I don’t buy that simplicity. There had to be more than that one option.
GENERAL COMMENT OR COMPLAINT: When you get right down to it, Richardson is a third or fourth banana.
REBUTTAL: I don’t disagree with that. But I don’t think Brandan Wright is going to be any better kind of banana.
Comments
Fair enough. I kid.
Think you forgot to mention that Nelson was never a big fan of JR's game. I think Nellie has as much to do with JR leaving as anything.
It's a shame that salary cap rules force a team to ditch its franchise player. It leaves the fans with an empty feeling. The old days of being able to root for a player for his whole career are long gone and that sucks.
Regarding Wright and him being ant better than JRich. I can never see him cracking the starting 5. People who are high on BWright are just blind. He's a complimentary player that Nellie will use to exploit a matchup in certain situations with certain teams, and not all of them. He'll look good when he gets playing time because his matchups will be good for him. He's just not starting material in the NBA, especially on a Nellie coached team that demands each player other than his center to create from outside the paint and in. Being a lw post player, he will need to improve his shooting dramatically at the line since he will be fouled near the basket. AR has a much, much higher ceiling because he fits Warrior style basketball in that he can create and score from anywhere on the court.
As a warrior fan and a close friend to Jason Richardson, I would like to thank you for writing this about him. His brother and I knew all along that the trade was not going to bring the warriors anywhere last season. We all knew they tried to get KG, but that failed. I like reading the negativities that fans write about Jason because it just motivates him even more.
He had a slow start at the beginning of the season last year because of the newborn baby. But his family and even himself knew that he was going to blow up in the 2nd half of the season. People based Jason's performance when he had his first surgery in his life on his knee and his broken wrist. I would remember Jason would practice by himself until midnight when he was trying to recover. That guy got game and heart. And heart is what the warriors do not have right now.
Mullin picked BD over J Rich when he traded him away because Monta was not ready at the 1 position when they were in the KG sweepstakes. But that did bite them back in the rear. Based on the stats on this link, http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2008_leaders.html, Jason Richardson is in 8-9 categories, and you can barely find Corey (No offense to maximus 50 so people got to stop comparing J rich with Corey). People forgot J Rich lit up the healthy Warriors with 42 points when G Wallace was hurt. Jason did not do well the first game against the Warriors in Oakland because he was overwhelmed. I am not sure if he shed tears that night when he seen fans wearing 23 (including myself), but he was definitely surprised even after giving his jersey number to CJ Watson on his return.
Jason Richardson was one of the players who improved his stats the most in the 2005-2006 season. People forget that when we made it to the playoffs, Jason was the biggest part of that run. Everyone thought that the Stack Jack and Al Harrington trade was not going to help them to make it to the playoffs when J Rich was still hurt, but all they needed was an 80% healthy Jason Richardson.
People forget who slammed OKUR into the ground when OKUR was trying to embarrass the Dubs and the Jazz were up by so many points with how many seconds left in the 4th quarter. People forget that J Rich only missed 2 fts in Game 2 and BD missed 3 and pietrus missed more and Utah caught up. People forgot that J Rich was not gettin the ball in Game 5. People forget J Rich was a Mavericks killer even in the playoffs. People forget a lot of positive things, we only remember the negative things.
The Warrior Fans are never satisfied until the dubs go further in the playoffs or even make it to the playoffs. I put all my money that if Jason was still on the team last year, they would've made it to the playoffs without a doubt (5th or 6th in the west). Especially, with that kind of run they had in the last 2 months of the 06-07 season, they were unstoppable with just 2-3 months of playing ball as a team with Sjax and Al.
In response to J Canseco, the way Nellie motivate his players is by doubting them. Nellie said in the interview last season that he misses JR, but they got to move on and he even complained about having a rookie on his team. Nellie would not say he misses a guy if he did not like him. The biggest thing that the Dubs will never get in return on that BW trade is heart. And that's not something you can trade for.
I dunno, I think there's some flawed logic here.
Maggette's 5/50 contract being bad doesn't make Jrich's 3/40 any better imo. As much as I trash the deal we gave him, Maggette is a better scoring option than Jrich.
Better teammate? Probably not.
But, he is overall a more efficient offensive threat and a slightly better defender. He's also a better fit in our running offense than Jrich was, who at times during that playoff stretch run looked like solely a spot-up shooter alongside better driving guards in Baron, Monta, and Jack.
And let's be real, Stephen Jackson and Harrington at the 4/5 was a token line up we used to close out the final 29 games of the season and to frustrate a soft PF like Dirk. You keep those guys at those spots for 82 games and they're probably on IR by game 50.
Regarding the actual "loss" of talent, I say this: Even if Brandan Wright becomes a 3rd or 4th banana, at least he'll be more of a defensive 3rd or 4th banana type than a purely offensive one. He hasn't shown the ability to be a huge offensive threat, but he has shown he can be a pretty good finisher, a plus rebounder, and a solid shot blocking presence inside.
When you have weapons all over the floor offensively like the W's, you take a flier on guys like that over Jrich anyday of the week imo.
Not a lot of good teams 3rd or 4th best player are pure offensive players for a reason. Those guys are really a dime a dozen in the league, and most of them play for bad teams.
Scoring wins you awards, interior defense wins you rings.
All things considered, that was a no brainer deal for the W's.
I think another thing that was considered in trading Richardson is his poor free throw shooting. Too many games lost over the last few years have been due to poor FT shooting.
I look at some of the guys being added to the roster now, and I see an improved FT shooting team. How many more victories will this ensure?
I agree with you that the Jason Richardson trade was a mistake, although i'm still fine with the route we went with anyways. We still have a good future in our hands, but it sucks that we had to break up that 06-07 team that only played 21 games together in the regular season that year. Your article sparked a big conversation over at www.goldenstateofmind.com
You should go check it out and see the arguments about Richardson. There's a lot of great points on both sides of the argument.
Matt- I understand the frustration you must be feeling w/the dubs so narrowly missing the playoffs, then losing their heart/soul, and replacing it with...Corey. sucks. But you have to look at it for what it was. It was a play for KG. It failed, and we ended up with a worse team in the short term for it. Way too many abstract ideas, what-ifs, coulda-woulda-shouldas...when all you need to do is look at a failed play for KG (which for any sane person, was a reasonable play to make).
I noticed you ignored another reason we disagree with you...
One reason many weren’t ready to agree with you was because the jury is still out on Wright. Your refusal to acknowledge that Wright may be a very good player down the road makes your argument very one sided. If Wright doesn’t get much better than he has shown – I agree with you – but it is too soon to say!
Wright, if you or any of your peoples are reading this – PLEASE PROVE MATT WRONG!
I love jason richardson, but you vastly overrate him as a player and his contribution to the team.
I think a major issue you are overlooking is the micro-fracture surgery richardson had the offseason prior to being traded (2006). He missed significant playing time during that season and was rusty and lacked explosiveness even when he did play. Even in the playoffs that year he looked terrible and was relegated to being stand still jump shooter similar to how he was in his 2nd year in the league. Aside from hoisting 3's, richardson did very little to take any offensive pressure off of baron davis. A complete 1-dimensional player.
In short, it wasn't clear that he'd recover fully from micro fracrture surgery. And for a player who relies so much on his leaping ability, that is a killer.
And while richardson did rebound for a nice season last year, it's clear he's not a player that would have significantly helped the warriors. He would have added a little depth at the sg/sf position, but he would have done little for the defensive woes or rebounding problems. Another jump shooter like richardson simply does not add all that much to the warriors (599 3 pointers attempted against just 331 freethrows attempted).
I'm not a big fan of brandnan wright, but at least richardson was traded for a player at a position of need and a player who has the potential to be make a bigger impact on a game then richardson. I look at the trade as a wash in terms of talent, and a win for the warriors because of the financial relief.
Crazy as it sounds but trading JRich and not making the playoffs was the best thing to ever happen to us. Had we made the playoffs we would've gotten swept by the Lakers and ended up with Kosta Koufus instead of Anthony Randolph. Randolph gonna be a star, he's the best prospect we've had since Webber. We finally caught a break, you can thank the big rebounder in the sky for things happening the way it did.
"Trading Richardson wasn't the only way to get there." Boy, without throwing out an alternative, that's a really weak argument. So is saying, they shouldn't have made the bad signings that put them in that situation. They were not going to pay the luxury tax, they didn't know Baron was going to leave, they knew they wanted to sign Ellis and Biedrens long term, and they had an opportunity to get it done with certainty by trading JRich for a good prospect. Yeah, a no brainer.
Uh, the reason Monta won most improved player was because he played all the time when j-rich was hurt.
Matt,
I agree with you mostly. I think Richardson was probably moved for a number of different reason, one of them being that Mullin thought he had a shot at landing Kevin Garnett on draft day. In fact, several sources say that Mchale was urging Garnett to take the Warriors offer of Wright, Ellis, and possibly a few #1 picks for Garnett and the horrible contract of Marko Jaric. Of course, we now know Garnett chose to go to Boston instead.
On the flip side, I don't think the Warriors missed Jason all that much. The Warriors went on to win 6 more games last year than the previous year. Richardson is less a winning player than Corey Magette who I have heard you say isn't a winning type of player. Case in point, Richardson is at his best when he is the best player on a poor to sub-par team.
You also have to factor in that he had knee surgery and the Warriors had a stud in the making in Ellis. I think Ellis at 22 is already light years better than J-Rich and his ceiling is alot higher. Jason is 28, he is what he is. A good player, not a great one.
Let me take you back to game 4 of the Utah series.
Game 4, Sunday Mother's day. Tailgaitng at the seldlien club lot. 5:15,,,, 45 minutes prior to tip off,, in coems racing a beautiful green Bentley with one Jason richardson behind the wheel. He looks panicked and well he should. This was the biggest game of his career! Yet he shows up 45 minutes before tipoff? I thought what the heck was he thinking? Well the rest is history. He plays perhaps the worst game of his career scoring 3 points. We loss going down 3-1 in the series and I celebrated when they traded him! He should have been at the ARENA 2-3 hours before tipoff time. But obviously JRich has other prioroties and winning this game was not one of them. This is why he was traded and its a very good reason!
matt, why are you so negative about Wright now? The guy was 19 and 205 lbs in the NBA last year yet his per minute statistics were excellent--better than Bosh's as a frosh! You can't blame Wright for Nelly's insistence that Pietrus was a PF and that Harrington is a C. the lack of impact is a result of a lack of playing time--not the other way around.
What are the other options besides trading JRich to get salary cap room? They already traded Dunleavy, Murphy, and most of the other big money players. They couldn't trade Adonal Foyle. Give us some options since you are an insider. JRich was good, but too many limitations for his salary. Buike will prove to be more than capable of filling most of his shoes.
Steinmetz is a baby. It's great journalism to talk about a trade in hindsight. It's great journalism to compare an established player who has had almost a decade of experience and opportunity to a rookie who wasn't given a fair amount of playing time. Then to say this kid isn't going to be good is all speculation. There is no way that with Richardson here Nellie would have continued to play Richardson at the 3. That would have hindered Biedrins growth and made the Warriors even smaller than normal. With Richardson leaving we were able to see Monta blossom into a 20 point scorer and Biedrins into an up and coming double double machine. If Richardson were still here we wouldn't have Maggette. They are similar players, good scorers and rebounders, except Maggete has handles and shoots way more free throws at a higher percentage. So, Steinmetz can cry all he wants, but this was a good trade.
Matt, although I still disagree with you, your effort to address the concerns of the bloggers reading your article is laudable and much appreciated. It is good to know that you take time to read the comments and remain a part of the fan community despite your more direct connection with the franchise as a sideline reporter. Kudos to you! That being said, I still have to disagree with you. I love J-Rich and he is by far my favorite warrior of my lifetime, but he wasn't going to get us a ring. If the franchise is satisfied with an annual second round exit, then keeping J-Rich would have been solid, but we just didn't have the pieces to get to the next level. The level necessary to win a championship. Shaking up the team, and giving up more financial room was an effort to get there. Granted we did not take advantage of the opportunity the extra breathing room gave us (failed KG attempt, etc), it was worth trying. We could have kept J-Rich and gotten rocked again by Utah or whatever team, but instead we tried to become successful instead of just exciting. I agree that it is too early to see how our "experiment" panned out, but again, it was worth a shot. J-Rich wasn't going to take us to the next level, but I must concede that there are no indicators that wright will either (although as others have noticed it is too early to draw any conclusions)
Matt, pretending that you are smarter than Mullin and Nelson is a losing battle. The team's much improved record in a tougher conference contradicts your conclusion. The Warriors missed the playoffs because Baron Davis was inconsistent and unfocused. You greatly underestimate Biedrins and Maggette, both of whom are more consistent and have a much higher field goal percentage than Richsrdson. Biedrins even led the NBA in FG percentage. That Brandan Wright played as much as he did speaks in his favor. His field goal percentage also far exceeded Richardson's, despite rarely having an opportunity to get in the flow of the game.
This is such a useless discussion. Us trading Webber after his first year is still much more of a headscratcher.
Ellis made up for Richardson being traded. I might even go as far as saying Ellis was better last year than Richardson ever was. Better shooter, team defender, and scored in clutch situations. Richardson was never clutch, not so say I did not love having him on the team.
Everything happens for a reason and look who we have now because of all of the events of the last few years, Anthony Randolph.
He looks like he could either be the best draft choice since Webber or the biggest dissapointment since Joe Smith. (only cause he is getting our hopes up with his summer play)
I'ts correct thatthe Ws needed to clear cap room, but they needed it, as we all can see, THIS year, not last season. With Jackson out for the first six games, how many do you think the Ws woulda won? 2, 3, 4? And what would that do to their record, and how much less tired would BD and SJ have been at the end of the season. Admittedly, it's hard to know their record for the rest of the season, but it is also hard to see that JRich's contribution would have been more that BW.
So, in my estimation Mullin lost getting into the playoffs with that trade, in an attempt to get KG, and could have dealt JRich this offseason to sign Ellis and Biedrins.
Not only would J-Rich not have halted ME's development or have hindered keeping Ellis and Biedrins, it shouldn't have mattered. I'll go one step further: Monta Ellis and Andris Biedrins shouldn't even be here. Getting Baron was catching lightning in a bottle. After the 07 playoff run, that was the time for the Warriors to go "all-in" on Baron, S-Jacks, J-Rich and traded Ellis and Biedrins for the dynamic front-court presence they've lacked.
Whether it was offering both for Garnett or even a Kirilenko or Bosch, you have to make a play. I know salary cap, other players, etc factor into it. I'm just saying there comes a time when you don't hedge, you go for it. The Warriors missed their time. Now that they missed it, I'm glad Biedrins and Ellis are around but when they hit their prime, I hope Warriors management will have the guts to make the bold play for a title contender. They missed their shot with Baron.
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