The Arkansas Department of Human Services and the Miller County Department of Human Services have kept mum about why they took 36 children of members of the Tony Alamo Christian Ministries into custody in two separate police and child protective services raids a year ago. Since Family Court judge Joe Griffin issued a gag order, the parents have not been able to talk about the charges.
However, an affidavit filed in federal court to substantiate bad faith on the part of the Arkansas Department of Human Services in the seizure of the 36 children reveals some of the allegations against the parents. The parents deny each and every allegation.
The allegations are:
1. Both parents knew of the abuse of two children in the church and did nothing about it. Both parents state that they knew nothing about any such abuse.
2. Both parents endorsed and facilitated attempted marriages between underage females and adult males. Parents deny the allegation, stating that they have no authority to marry or permit marriage between any individuals, and that their children are all too young to be married.
3. The father slapped one child on one occasion on the face with an open hand. Father denies any such slap occured.
4. Parents failed to send 7 year old child to accredited school or to properly register for homeschooling. Parents claim they sent their children to the school run by the church which meets all state requirements for schooling. Furthermore, tests done since the child has been in foster care shows that he is advanced for his age, therefore no educational neglect can be said to have taken place.
5. Parents committed medical and physical abuse by allowing children to participate in an involuntary fast. While parents believe in fasting for spiritual reasons, they deny ever forcing their children to participate in a fast.
6. Parents committed medical neglect by not vaccinating their children. Parents state that they have received exemptions on religious grounds from the State of Arkansas, therefore they are within their rights in not having their children vaccinated.
The first two charges have nothing to do with the parent's own children, and the rest are surprisingly mild considering the State's secrecy about them. The State has the burden of proving all of these charges. Because of the gag order by Judge Griffin, it is unclear as to what, if any, evidence the State has produced to substantiate their allegations.
Comments
They have No evidence that these children were ever abused or in any imminent danger of abuse.
So far there has been NO evidence at all. None against Pastor Alamo. None against any abuse happening at all.
There has only been allegations of witnesses who have been coerced, bribed by the Feds. The whole reason is to destroy the word of God and the people from preaching it.
It's Religious persecution.
These children were never abused until they raided the ministry in a swat style raid and had machine guns pointed at their chest, stolen out of the arms of their parents on the roadside just before any of them could testify in court against the false accusations. The horrible abuse has been in fact at the hands of the DHS, Foster parents, Judges and feds.
People need to wake up to what is really going on here in America.
As Dan has stated in the past several other separated churches have been attacked. Others will be next if they are able to get away with this atrocity.
Oh, man, this really ticks me off! These state workers are going to be called to account for what they have done to these children and their families one day. And it won't be before an earthly judge. Hebrews 10:31 - "It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God."
Tony Alamo is only guilty of loving god that is all that why they raided the church to Bear False witnesses against the Tony Alamo ministries, they only serve god almighty, now because of this they do not worship the pope, that is way you devils shot those kids with the mark of the beast so call swine flu is totally poison and they will die slowly but surely, gave them vaccine without their parent permission and tried to mess up the good work Tony Alamo have been doing 45 years for the lord, But god and his saints already won 2000 years ago at Calvary when Jesus Christ shed his precious blood, all witnesses are lying they even tried to bride me not to go back to the Alamo Christisn Church here in L.A.and threat me too physical harm even death but God Almighty with protect his people and not a thing poison will harm them, a promise from god almighty, revenge is god he will repay.
Hey Dan! I wanted to add that one of those homeschooled students is now a National Honors Student. She's 17. The state didn't turn her into an honors student in 6 months, she was clearly already very educated. Ironically, DHS is wanting this child to serve on a foster care advisory board made up of teens. She continues to state that she wants to return to her parents.
According to CPS and CASA, the original reason they went in and kidnapped the children was because they were being used for kiddie porn.
Which CPS/CASA worker took all the KP home and put it in their private stash?
Where did it all go? Where are all the camera's, video tapes, movie sets?
Like the YFZ Ranch attack, this whole case was BS from the gitgo.
These are the same parent's that knew about Tony Alamo marrying girls as young as 8 years old right? Well they denied that too but it was proven in court. Frankly, if they knew about that and turned a blind eye that makes them child abusers. If they truly didn't know and now the truth is out and they still support a monster like that and they refuse to believe it after it was proven in a court of law, well then they should not be allowed the privilege of caring for any child. They continue to show poor judgment by even associating themselves with a creep like Alamo. They are free to worship God anywhere in the U.S.A. but aligning themselves with a pedophile will not get them their children back and exhibits extremely illogical behavior.
Child Advocate, The parents say they didn't know any such thing. The government has to prove their case, and so far it doesn't look like they have. Do you think every Catholic, Jewish or Baptist kid should be removed from a church because the priest or minister was found guilty of molesting children? Many people stand behind their priest or minister after he or she has been found guilty of sexual abuse, but none of them, except in this case, have had all of their children taken away.
There was NEVER any proof or evidence that Pastor Alamo was guilty of the charges he was convicted of.
Just false testimony from former members that have been known to be liars, coerced by the government and people like Child Advocate that don't need any proof to believe the lies and gossip heard in this hate and slander campaign to try to destroy this bible believing church, Pastor, parents and their children.
See the evidence that Pastor Alamo is innocent.
www(dot)alamoministries(dot)com/Newsletters/08300(dot)pdf
Mat 18:6 But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
Whether or not Tony Alamo is guilty or innocent is not material here. The parents of the children who were removed should be found guilty or innocent based on their actions, not on their beliefs or associations. To bring up Tony Alamo's guilt or innocence is to muddy the waters of the case of the parents, which is a completely separate case. The parents should not be considered guilty just because Tony Alamo was found guilty by a jury. Neither should the parents have been found innocent if Tony Alamo had been found innocent. The parents' guilt or innocence should be based solely on whether or not they committed criminal acts. I see no evidence that they did, which is why I support the parents.
Child advocate is probably a dhs employee or one of those ex Alamo members thats trying to make a bunch of money off their fabrications of all their supposed tortures. Meanwhile the public knows there was no weapons over there. How lame do these gutless ppl want us think they are that they would stick around for all this "torture" when they could have come and gone as they pleased. You might collect some money from big brother now, but in the long run you'll pay more than you got.Now these ex-members are the kind that will take my statement and run crying to the fbi and dhs and say stephon was threatening to kill us.This is the kind of govt. zombies were dealing with. Ive seen their post's on other forums. Now go get in line for your money and the swine flu vaccine,child advocate, like a good obedient little sheep
Age of mandatory child school attendance varies by state. In some states, not required until the child is age 8.
Interested to know what Arkansas' mandatory attendance statute states.
Child Advocate needs to shut up with their false accusations and talking about something that they know nothing about. I have known Tony Alamo for 34 years and there was never any abuse at his church. Child Advocate is probably a pedophile and CPS worker. Tony Alamo did not marry girls that were eight years old any more than Child Advocate did. For all we know Child Advocate is an abusive person having sex with 8 year olds or younger. How does it feel to be falsely accused? These parents never did anything abusive to their children. I know because my brother and sister are some of the children that were kidnapped from their parents and our parents never abused us in any way. So all you people out there that think you know so much about our church but you have never even been to it why don't you keep your lying mouths shut and come see for yourselves that there is no abuse and that we help homeless and poor people all the time.
Regarding Cheryl's comment about the 17 year old National Honor Society student who is in foster UNcare:the DHS answers that back
saying that the girl has a high IQ, therefore she is able to be invited into the National Honor Society. Doesn't matter how high your IQ is, you still have to have a solid educational foundation to make qualifying grades for that society. Obviously, her education was not neglected prior to being in a public high school. And she still wants to be back with her loving family, showing her good common sense.
Regarding Dan Weaver's comparison to Catholic, Jewish or Baptists kids being removed from their church after ministers or priests have been found guilty of molestation - the situation isn't exactly the same since the Alamo follower's children actually live on the church property and the parent's depend on the church to provide them with housing, food, etc. BUT as parents of any children should, in either situation, they should have enough common sense to remove their children from that type of situation. I don't think it is unreasonable to ask the Alamo parent's to live independent of the church in order to get their kids back. It doesn't mean they can no longer worship Tony, it just means that they will no longer be reliant on him for providing for their families.
Regarding the comments from Angel, Stephon and Susan - You all sound a bit mentally unstable so I won't waste too much time with your bizarre replies but I do want to say that if you are genuinely decent people then you can continue to do God's work without aligning yourself with a convicted pedophile. It seems to me that doing so doesn't make much sense as the Bible teaches to follow Christ and not man. Your devotion to Tony Alamo resembles idol worship. Put that energy into serving the Lord and your lives will be blessed and your children might be returned to you.
Ok, one more...Regarding Dan Weaver's comment "the parents of the children who were removed should be found guilty or innocent based on their actions, not on their beliefs or associations". I agree with you but they are not just associated with Tony Alamo. He controls every aspect of their lives. He orders punishments through beatings and forced fasts. He decides the fate of marriages and where children live within the group, etc..His undeniable control over the fate of the children in this group has a huge bearing on the court's decision. If these parents really wanted their kids back they would move to China if that is what was required to prove they are not influenced by this convicted criminal. The fact that they continue to fight to stay in that environment shows poor judgment because they are putting their kids in harms way and will go against them when trying to obtain custody of their kids.
All the things said about the Tony Alamo Church, and by the way I do not support Tony Alamo or the beliefs of his church, were said about the FLDS in Texas. Nevertheless the FLDS children were returned to their parents without a requirement that they leave the church property, nor were they required to get secular jobs. This case is unprecedented in American History. Other comments made by Child Advocate are totally offbase. Apparently he or she had never attended a Baptist Church--one of the many run by dictators--where parents are totally under the pastor's thumb even though they may live off the church property and have secular employment. Tony Alamo is not the only minister who has parishoners under his thumb. But parents in his church are the only ones so far who have been asked to choose between their religious beliefs and their children. But not to worry, if these children are taken away permanently, yours may be next.
To all concerned. Comments which make spurious charges and unsupported statments will be deleted. If you want to accuse people of crimes that even the state has not charged them with, then you had better offer some proof if you want your comments posted. Libelous and slanderous comments will not be tolerated.
Well, I put proof in my last posts and you still deleted them so the truth probably isn't really what you are looking for. You are on a mission to be recognized for whatever journalism kudos you are trying to achieve and these children's welfare appears to play second fiddle to that.
Child Advocate, You did not offer proof. You simply made unsubtantiated statements and acted as if they were facts. If you have proof that these parents have committed crimes, please arrange to get it to me by contacting me at danieltweaver@gmail.com. I'm not looking for kudos only the truth. If you can send me proof, in the form of documents that would hold up in court, or some other kind of evidence, I will be glad to reconsider my position.
I've been following this story for a while and people like Tom "A" and the Devil's Child Advocate and Twilight Zoned and Betty Boop obviously don't care anything about the welfare of these children. They obviously have an axe to grind against Tony Alamo. They were probably put out of his church for some perverted thing they did. They have the same mentality as the CPS/DHS which would rather have these children that were being raised in a wholesome, God-fearing environment and sheltered from the likes of these scum be placed in an unsafe, filthy, degenerated, abusive, dangerous environment (foster care and orphanages) where there's extensive proof of thousands of children suffering and even being murdered at the hands of these scum liars that claim to be protecting them from their truly, loving and godly, caring parents; not to mention all the heartache and mental anguish they put the children and parents through. If they were really godly like they pretend to be, they would be outraged
cont. outraged at this grotesquely, evil, one-world government organization that usurps the authority of God, condemning God's Word and carrying out these atrocities on untold thousands of innocent families. And these children in particular being used as pawns to destroy this fundamental church. But you don't seem to care about all the atrocities that happened to children that are taken away by the "government". You have a kindred spirit with them (ANTICHRISTS). The government can spew out their lies freely and shred evidence and do just about anything they want unjustly and take your kids away for no reason at all; the fact is, these parents are not guilty of any of the allegations that were brought against them. The fact is, the government is acting illegally. The people of this country should make a stand against them and get them back under control and get our freedoms back. You people make yourself so obvious, YOU STINK OUT LOUD!!!
The fact that these parents continue to support their leader after all of these years, and considering the current conviction, puts these children in danger to be with them. They are not making choices that indicate they are capable of keeping these children out of harms way (harms way being Tony Alamo's perversions). State custody may not be the greatest place for these kids but considering the alternative it is the best place for them.
Texarkana Gazette today; "During Alamo’s trial, in court documents and in hearings held for related cases, assertions that Alamo loyalists abdicated their parenting decisions to Alamo, allowed their children to be beaten with boards and permitted the cessation of schooling when laborers were needed, repeatedly surfaced.
During a hearing last week to address a civil lawsuit seeking damages from John Kolbek, a ministry member accused of beating children and adults at Alamo’s bidding, the foster mother of a girl removed from Alamo’s house in Fouke, Ark., Sept. 20, 2008, testified the girl asked her parents at a recent meeting why they wouldn’t do what it would take to get her back.
'The mother told her daughter she’d been in the ministry for 39 years, I think, and that if she quit now, it would all be for nothing,' the foster mother said. '(The girl) broke down. She was sobbing.'"
This outrages me, Susan. The parents who would allow this out of loyalty to Alamo.
Devil's Child Advocate, you don't know anything about this case except what you read in the newspaper. How do you know that there are any perversions by Tony Alamo? You have never been to his church. Just another case of the media lying and slandering an innocent Pastor. You're overlooking one thing, the government lied in the courtroom and so did the false witnesses that got paid to lie, and so did the DHS kidnappers. They can't prove anything. Did you know that at Tony's trial the jury told the judge that there wasn't any evidence that Tony took girls across state lines for sex and there was no evidence of sex on the trips and they asked the judge if they could still convict him? Do you know what the judge replied? He said "Read the original instructions" (which was to find him guilty no matter what). These children were never in harm's way in that church. But wouldn't you say that they are now in harm's way since 3 out of a family of 6 children have been molested?
Well, Susan, it is YOU that are now making unsubstantiated statements and acting as if they were facts. If you have proof that these things happened in the courtroom and to the children in state custody, please arrange to get it to Daniel Weaver at danieltweaver@gmail.com or he may delete your comment like he did mine.
And I don't have to read about any abuses in the paper to KNOW that your "church" is a sanctuary for pedophiles and child abusers as I lived in it as a child and have many friends who were able to escape it. We many not have had a voice when we were children in there but we are now grown and will be silent no longer.
If you continue to align yourself with the likes of Alamo and his ilk you will never see your children again until they are adults and by then they may not want to see YOU again for what you have done. Choosing to stay in Alamo's group over custody of your kids is insanity. You can worship God anywhere...
Child Advocate. Even if, as you imply, you have first hand knowledge of things in the church because you grew up in the church, that still does not supply evidence that the parents currently having hearings in family court did anything wrong. If some people in the church did wrong, that does not then mean that everyone in the church did. You cannot say that everyone is guilty simply by their association with Tony Alamo or the church. And I do have evidence that the children have been neglected and abused in foster care.
Furthermore, Child Advocate, if Tony Alamo is in prison, how is he going to molest children? Are you implying that the parents who are now involved in hearings are going to take their children on visits to the prison for that purpose? If so, you have a twisted mind!
Dan, you obviously haven't done your research on this group. It is documented in the court records from Alamo's most recent trial that his followers brought his last half dozen "wives" to him in JAIL when he was incarcerated for tax fraud while they were CHILDREN and he molested them while the wives watched out for the guards and the camera rotation. It so happens to be an HONOR in this "church" to be favored by the "prophet" and the parents who allow these kinds of abuses get special treatment in the group, more power or better jobs, etc...As long as these parents continue to drink the koolaid their children will be in danger. And YES, a few of these parents are among those who have already given their daughters to this despot. They are no longer children and heavily indoctrinated since birth so you will hear no accusations from them on this matter. The state needs to protect the rest of the kids. ALL of the children in that group are in danger of abuse.
Child Advocate, I assume with the conviction with which you are speaking that you have a copy of this court transcript. Please email it to me at danieltweaver@gmail.com so that I can read it.
The more I think about what you just wrote CA, the less it makes sense. If the parents, who are now having hearings, did as you say, why weren't they arrested and tried in criminal court? Nothing could be more disgusting than what you say happened. You say court documents say it happened, but was their other proof that it happened. If this testimony was given and believed to be true, arrest warrants should have gone out, and these parents should be in jail awaiting trial in criminal court, not attending a hearing in family court. It does not add up!!
Not all of the parent's in these custody cases participated in allowing their children to be molested by Alamo but there are a few who did. THOSE children are now adults, and as I've mentioned, some were the "wives" who testified in court and others are grown women now who believe that being married to Alamo is God's law and they see nothing wrong with it. What other proof do you expect under these circumstances? Victims and witnesses came forward in court about it. Unfortunately, the government had to pick their battles in regards to all of the charges leveled at Alamo. All concerned parties did hope that the government would press more charges against those involved in the jail-house visits (in 1993) and perhaps they will. I don't know the legalities surrounding all of the disgusting things I heard in court or how the accomplices can be made accountable for their part in the abuses but God will certainly take care of that.
So the bottom line is that the parents I have been supporting all along, not all the parents of TAM but the ones who had children taken last year in two raids, are not guilty of the things you claim some parents are guilty of. The fact that some parents might have done what you say does not mean that these parent did. I believe if they had, they would be in jail right now. A government that has the resources to pull off the raids they did, has the resources to convict people of crimes. It's obvious that the claims the government has against these particular parents, not the ones you cite, are minor or they would have been arrested. So we are back to square one, and I am getting tired of repeating myself. So let me sum up. I am opposed to Tony Alamo's ministry. I do not support him. I do not support anyone who abuses children. However, I also am opposed to the government taking children simply because their parents have an association with a religion that most people call a cult.
Well CA, I don't know who you are but I also grew up in the church and I know that Tony and the parents are innocent. The women were not molested when they went in to visit Tony in jail. It just goes to show that some "stupid" people will believe anything that they read or hear. I am related to the boy who won $1.5 million and I know he lied about what happened, but people like you who weren't there don't know that. I can see to try to persuade you is fruitless. You were probably put out of the church for molesting a child yourself. There's no point in talking to you.
Dan, you say, "The fact that some parents might have done what you say does not mean that these parent did. I believe if they had, they would be in jail right now. A government that has the resources to pull off the raids they did, has the resources to convict people of crimes."
This is one scenario that is playing out right now; one of these families did indeed give their daughter to Alamo as a child bride and she was one of the jail-house visitors. She is now an adult and believes Alamo to be a prophet and believes she is lucky to be married to him. So, who is to press charges for the arrests to be made? Not her. Not her own guilty parents. The government? What case would they have without her cooperation? Yet, they can save the rest of the children in that family from abuse by requiring the parents to become independent of Alamo and care for their children as state law requires, at the same time removing Alamo's leverage over them. Its not a solution but it is a start.
And the legal proof that this alleged girl was a child bride of Tony Alamo is what?
Dan, CA doesn't have any proof that the alleged girl was a child bride of Tony Alamo and he or she never will have proof. They probably ADVOCATE that children get kidnapped by the DHS.
Dan, the legal proof is in the transcripts of the trial of Tony Alamo in July 2009. I don't have a copy of the transcripts but I don't need to read about it as I was in the courtroom and heard it all. Keep in mind, the child brides were not the only witnesses to take the stand in this case. Read the names of the "wives" listed as being "married" to Alamo and you will find a few familiar names (if in fact they named them in the document---not sure the legalities of naming people who were minors and sexually abused). It is not my place to name them but I can assure you that CPS,DHS etc are well aware of this information. These people are not being honest with you and it is their MO in order to obtain media coverage. They have been deceiving the government and the media for decades now and you are just another sucker to them.
On a happier note; the FBI has stated that they intend to pursue those who were accomplices to the child abuse that went on in the group (at least the stuff they know about and can prove). I know you mentioned that as one of your defenses for some of these guilty parents ("If this testimony was given and believed to be true, arrest warrants should have gone out, and these parents should be in jail awaiting trial in criminal court, not attending a hearing in family court.")Now that Alamo has been sentenced, I believe you will begin to see this happen.
Good will ALWAYS prevail over evil. I just wonder when the light bulb will go off in these parent's heads.
Why wait until the sentencing? The conviction was months ago. Again you are not making a lot of sense. You still won't name names. You consider every parent in the church guilty by association, when that is highly unlikely.
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