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It is no secret that people have long protested not only the Harry Potter books but the movies as well. Many of those people who protest do so with their religious conviction in mind. Back in 1999, an Associated Press writer reported that a group of parents wanted the books kept from classrooms.
One parent, Elizabeth Mounce, was quoted as saying, "'The books have a serious tone of death, hate, lack of respect and sheer evil.'" At the time, the school principal, Jerry Locke, asked teachers to stop reading the books in classrooms until the issue was resolved. He said, "'It's questionable whether every parent wants their child to read or be exposed to books having to do with magic and wizardry.'"
Back in late 2002, there reportedly was an Anti-Harry Potter Conference in Lewiston, Maine. About 100 people attended to watch a minister cut up a copy of a Harry Potter book. They also watched a film that drew parallels between Harry Potter and "'real'" witchcraft. The minister, Rev. Douglas Taylor, said, "'I'm against Peter Pan, the Wizard of Oz. I'm against any kind of movie or book that has a kind of magical or cultish theme to it.'" (Ahem, what about the Bible?)
Back in 2006, in Atlanta, Laura Mallory was said to think that "Harry Potter [was] something far more sinister than a fictional character." It was also reported that "as far as [she] is concerned, the books help foster the kind of culture where school shootings take place. She believes that wouldn't happen if students were reading the Bible instead." (Has she actually read the Bible? It is rich with violence!)
So, the detest for anything Harry Potter has been well established here in the states. But, now, it seems, religious folk may have yet another reason to hate Harry Potter if all their other reasons weren't enough. At least Daniel Radcliffe thinks they might.
Though many people have suspected that Daniel Radcliffe is an atheist for some time now, he confirmed it in an interview with Esquire according to a report published on the Telegraph Web site. The Harry Potter star said:
I'm an atheist, but I'm very relaxed about it. I don't preach my atheism, but I have a huge amount of respect for people like Richard Dawkins who do. Anything he does on television, I will watch.
He went on to say jokingly:
There we go, Dan, that's half of America that's not going to see the next Harry Potter film on the back of that comment.
Comments
I have couple of questions that I am posing to the atheist movement at large here:
1). What do the atheists aim to do to make this world a better place (beyond asserting their rights)?
2). What have the atheists done so far to make the world a better place?
3). Do atheists have room for people in their ranks who are devotedly religious on themes/concepts/ideas they share with them?
I hope these questions are not construed as sarcastic as I am ask them sincerely...
There really isn't a "movement" among atheists; we're a group based on label about what we aren't, not what we are. But as for myself:
1/2: The same thing as religious people... just without the nuttery that often follows (e.g. passing laws based on religious dogma).
3. Sure. We have a lot in common about what we want in the world - better education, better health care, caring for the sick and needy, etc. We just don't think "spiritual health" should be the primary focus.
Who cares?? Dan is an amazing actor and I (personally) LOVE the HP series, so I'm definitely going to watch the movies when they come out in theater.
And Qamar, stop getting all complex and frustrated about the entire atheist movement. That's what some people believe and that's that. BOOHOO.
I AM Catholic so I know what it's like to be religious. BUT- don't go asking questions just about every article containing the word "atheist". I doubt you didn't even know who Daniel Radcliffe or the Harry Potter series was. Read before you talk. Idiot.
1). What do the atheists... make this world a better place
A. I don't believe in vampires. Not believing in vampires has no bearing on how I aim to make this world a better place. Not believing in gods is the same. Improving lives and repelling suffering is a goal shared by many whether one believes in vampires or gods, or neither.
2). What have the atheists done so far to make the world a better place?
See above. One might ask the same about those who don't believe in vampires.
3). Do atheists have room for people in their ranks who are devotedly religious on themes/concepts/ideas they share with them?
There are no "ranks". Atheists are just people who don't subscribe to a belief in gods. It is an idea that is found all over the world, but people who reject the notion of gods have no other common ties. Atheism has no church. No doctrine. No ceremonies. No binding rules. No "ranks".
Thanks Mike.
On no. 2, when you state: "the same thing as religious people", do you mean to say that atheists had some part to play in formation of red cross, Habitat for Humanity, salvation army, and other charitable organizations? if not, can you give any examples. It is important for me to know that atheists have put their words into actions. In my mind, to help the creation on the basis of our common creator is the motivation which is behind almost all charitable acts. I am trying to find out what is left when you remove it.
1.Countries that tend to be non-religious have the highest standards of living and less crime. Would that be a better place?
2.Atheists don't go to war in the name of their non-religion or attack or threaten others for the same reason.
3.You can't be an atheist AND religious! If the religious would only keep their ideas and concepts to themselves there would be no problem. But that will never happen!
1) Most atheists I know are doing it out of empathy and compassion for fellow human beings...not out of a fear of a divine being. We have one life after all and we're all humans, so we treat others right.
2) Many scientists are atheists. In the states, our scientists are often fighting religiously-motivated legislators in their pursuit of introducing religion into inappropriate subjects such as astronomy or biology. You can say the pursuit of knowledge and the effort to separate state and religion (which can have catastrophic results).
3) Yes, many of us are open-minded. We are all humans after all. However, we do prefer a more logical and reasonable approach than prayers and spiritual guidance.
Jamie, you are right, this may not be the place to ask these questions. I'll leave that up to each individual to decide.
I do know who Daniel Radcliffe and Harry Potter are. I have two daughters 3 and 7!
You are also correct that I am an idiot. An idiot with a right to ask questions.
S and John,
On no. 2, fair enough. I am with you in these pursuits.
I'm not an atheist but I have respect for the position. I don't understand why many religious people are so offended and threatened by atheism. Do they think atheists are likely to be attracted to religion and converted by their hateful attitudes? Sheesh.
Also, from before the time of recorded history humanity has valued fantasy both for entertainment and for symbolically conveying deep truths. How pathetic to deny this to children (or grownups, for that matter.) Was religion really damaged by Peter Pan and The Wizard of Oz back in the day?
A person's faith would have to be pretty weak for these wonderful stories to be a problem.
There is a difference between religion and morality. I know atheists who are more moral than many devoutly religious (whatever sect) people. Helping others is not the purview of only those who believe in a divine being.
Barbara,
can you cite examples of such non-faith based charitable organizations?
Qamar,
1) Atheists (or I prefer nontheists) do just as much as anybody else to make the world a better place. This question as akin to suggesting people don't contribute because they don't believe in Zeus (or any other belief system). I have never belonged to any religion and I make plenty of donations. People say this as if Atheists is a religion in itself with commandments not to contribute to the world.
2) See above.
3) Atheists have plenty room for theists. We're much more balanced, open minded and respectful of other people's beliefs. We don't try to blackmail authors/actors when we hear they're religious by encouraging everyone to not buy their work. Most nontheists subscribe to the notion that we all have a right to believe what we like so long as it doesn't harm others. On the flip-side it seems many devout theists try to dehumanize nontheists just because of their beliefs (or lack of it). This does not lead to a stable society if this elitist hatred is preached.
How much money has been poured into organized religion which could have otherwise been given to charity? If you've ever looked at the accounting for organized religion you'd be amazed how little of it gets put to good causes.
Secondly, how often is religion used for evil? Just look at Iran right now. The government repeatedly bring God into it trying to brainwash everyone that Europe are evil (itself a religious concept). Meanwhile they're murdering innocent people just because they hold an opposing political view in their fake democracy. How many childen have been molested not just by devote Christians but also by representatives high up in the Church? Priests/nuns have many times been exposed in the news. How many wars in history have been waged in the name of religion?
"can you cite examples of such non-faith based charitable organizations?"
Most (all?) scientific research. I have a Direct Debit setup for cancer research and when I signed up nowhere was religion brought into it, nowhere is it a prerequisite, and nowhere is it required for people to be members of the organization. And obviously, nowhere is religion needed for the application of the research.
When I donated to the Red Cross I didnt see a single mention of religion either. As above.
Consider Bill Gates. He gives billions to good causes. Nowhere is religion needed or advertised in their foundation. Bill is also considered nontheist.
I knew there was a reason I liked Daniel Radcliffe.
If nothing else, maybe such a high-profile young atheist will lead his generation out of the "atheist" closet.
Thanks Anthony!
To be clear, I have not suggested that non-theists or atheists do not contribute to such organizations nor that religious affiliation is a must for contribution.
An overwhelming majority of these organizations was inspired by religion at their inception. And an overwhelming majority of donors to these is also inspired by religion. That is my assessment. I try to give credit where credit is due. Bill Gates' foundation is an exception if he is indeed a non-theist. Lance Armstrong I believe also has a foundation for cancer and I am told that he is also a non-theist. If you have a chance, check these books out. They are available for reading online:
1). Revelation, Rationality, Knowledge & Truth
2). Murder in the name of Allah
I believe that Unicef and the United Way are also secular charitable groups, though Unicef often does use the church infrastructure to get donations.
But what's more important here is what Arthur and Anthony said. You don't found a charity based on what you don't believe; you found it on what you believe. Empathy, compassion, promotion of human rights and health; these are the sorts of things that are behind all charity, and religious charities often somewhat play toward this values to promote their message. Secular charities aren't burdened with the extra work of witnessing/faith promotion and can use all of the money to provide material needs to the needy.
"do you mean to say that atheists had some part to play in formation of red cross, Habitat for Humanity, salvation army, and other charitable organizations?"
Interesting question Qamar. I can speculate.
At the time they were established, religion was more dominant. Therefore just by basic statistics alone there was a greater chance that the people involved also happened to be religious. Or to put it another way, if for example 99% are religious and 0.000001% of those setup a charity, is religion really the driving force? In the case of the Red Cross it was setup by businessmen and engineers rather than churches/priests. If religion really was the driving force you'd expect it to be the latter I'd have thought.
In addition, the devout religious tend to advertise their faith through any mechanism available to them. If they have access to the public on this kind of scale the temptation to market their faith by wrapping it around the organization is too much of a temptation to pas
Some good points were made in response to my questions. But from recent posts, I am sensing the same kind of non-objective stubbornness that I find at right-left OR one religion vs. another debates...lack of reason and speculation abound to rationalize personal biases and going out of the way not to acknowledge contributions of others.
To those, I am sorry, I thought you guys were above this. I hope that one day you guys can hold your own rather than claiming being anti-religious as the sole reason for your existence. Scriptural guidance on being fair is pristine:
O ye who believe! be strict in observing justice, and be witnesses for God, even though it be against yourselves or against parents and kindred. Whether he be rich or poor, God is more regardful of them both than you are. Therefore follow not low desires so that you may be able to act equitably. And if you conceal the truth or evade it, then remember that God is well aware of what you do.
Was I the only one who noticed Harry Potter celebrating Christmas? Dan is an actor, he had no hand in writing the books and obviously has no problem playing a religious charactor. The people who actually read the book, burn the book, cut the book, or go see the film and get angry, have some serious issues. These people have no reason to believe what they are about to see or read has anything to do with their religion or personal belief. This is a story, fictional story about a magical place. Life is way too short to be that stupid. Books and movies are for information or entertainment, this was was entertainment, not a book to live your life by. The bible could be compared to the HP books, their both story books, but it's not quite the same. They just need something to b*tch about. I for one am glad Dan was honest.
techskeptic.blogspot.com/2007/12/atheist-charities.html
Every book burned is a book bought, so even in trying to stop it, they make JK Rowling richer.
I think we as atheists need to start attending these book burnings, so we can toss bibles on the bonfire.
Qamar,
So you start out by trying to portray yourself as a balanced individual open to debate, asking questions and sharing your thoughts.
Then in your last post you get in a hissy fit just because everyone didn't kneel down and worship some religion-based charities, try to discredit others opinions through worthless jabs alone void of tangible info, and conclude with religious chanting in a bid to echo the dogma you've been brainwashed with. You must feel proud of yourself.
Just to make you happy. Some charities started by religious people and brought some good. Happy now?
However all the other responses to this still stand. And this argument spills over into "Are deluded people doing ANY good?" rather than "Are they deluded?".
Recent case in point of why donating to religion is a waste of money:
"Religious broadcaster builds $4M home despite layoffs at his ministry"
"Cerullo has said 80 cents of each donated dollar is spent to spread the Gospel."
Hear that? 80% of donations are used to spread delusion instead of help people in need.
Article: tr.im/rgEA
But don't let that stop your elitist smugness that religion is linked to some religions.
Oh, and you can add another to the list. My last donation was to Greenpeace. Absolutely nowhere is religion mentioned or required at any point. THOSE are the kind of people doing real work to help people.
@Qamar Ahmad
1). What do the atheists aim to do to make this world a better place?
The same stuff the religious people do. Reduce crime, poverty, hunger, etc. Our actions don't require a deity to do them.
2.) What have the atheist done so far to make the world a better place?
Why are there so many theists that can't type "atheist charities" or "secular charities" into google?
3.) We don't have ranks. There is no Pope, priests, generals, kings, dukes, etc. Atheism is not an organisation or a religion. It is simply a descriptor for someone who lacks belief in a deity. As for secular and/or atheist charities, we don't care who helps so long as religion is kept out of it.
While I appreciate that you seem to be asking sincerely, I can't help but be annoyed because so many times these same questions are answered, and so often theists seem to refuse to believe it could be true that atheists could help improve anything. Please do a few minutes of research in google.
"Barbara,
can you cite examples of such non-faith based charitable organizations?"
I'll answer for her...
www (dot)thinkatheist (dot) com (slash)notes (slash) Secular_charities
Next time, please do your own research, so it doesn't look like you're grasping at straws waiting for the moment you can say "See atheists don't do anything!" when someone doesn't know a whole list of secular charities off-hand.
You spent more time asking people here than it would have taken to just look it up in google for yourself.
Please. The kid's 20, and pop "atheism" is a fad. Who knows what he'll believe when he grows up.
Disclosure: devout Catholic, ex-Pagan, two degrees, prolife, feminist, science geek
Unsolicited advice: before you make up your mind about any group, or person, or set of ideas, listen to both sides talk about themselves and about their detractors. As Bishop Sheen once said, "Most people don't hate what the Catholic Church teaches... they hate what they think the Catholic Church teaches."
P.S. See h t t p://sqpn.com/?s=Harry+Potter for fisheaters who grok wizardry.
Atheist or not. When 100 people get together to watch a "minister" tear up a book, it isn't a good thing. No book should be singled outfor destruction to try stop it from being read. Ultimately, it will bring more attention to the books and attract more people to read them. Also, there are a lot of morals in the Harry Potter books. Most of the people who protest them, haven't bothered reading them.
Just my two cents.
@Kell Brigan
"Please. The kid's 20, and pop "atheism" is a fad. Who knows what he'll believe when he grows up."
1.) So what if he's 20? Most atheists I know became atheists in their teens. And, what are you talking about it's a fad? Fads go in and out... like the type of clothes to wear. Atheism has been increasing around the world for decades and no one becomes a member of America's most distrusted minority because it's the cool thing to do.
"Disclosure: devout Catholic, ex-Pagan, two degrees, prolife, feminist, science geek"
None of this backs up your statements about calling atheism a "fad" or that because he's 20 he doesn't have the mental capacity to choose to be atheist. For someone who claims to have two degrees, you sure haven't applied any of the scientific scrutiny that you should have learned to point it at religion and ask "where's the proof?"
@Kell (part 2)
"Unsolicited advice: before you make up your mind about any group, or person, or set of ideas, listen to both sides talk about themselves and about their detractors."
Before you make up your mind? How about following what the evidence best shows and retaining the ability to change it in light of new evidence?
"As Bishop Sheen once said, "Most people don't hate what the Catholic Church teaches... they hate what they think the Catholic Church teaches.""
Okay... the catholic church teaches, because the Pope said, that using condoms spreads AIDS. That's only caused millions more people to become infected with AIDS...
Oh, they also teach that no matter how good of a person you are, if you don't believe in Jesus you'll go to hell. I guess that's a justified belief too, right?
I was a catholic, I know what they teach, and it's despicible.
What pathetic arguments you make to dismiss someone's choice to call them an atheist... Sad. Just sad.
Wow...how completely and utterly immature!!!! I can't believe that grown adults would go to watch a book being torn up. Please people this is fiction and it's got rich plot which in the end shows the power of LOVE!!! Are we shunning love? Are we shunning imagination?! I believe that Harry Potter is an absolutely wonderful book series and I am embarrassed because I live in a world with people who would burn books and keep "evil" literature from their children. And the bible is FULL of witchcraft and cults and things far worse than Harry Potter.
i am 15,indian and my name is seetha lakshmi.. i study in a christian school.i accidently once mentioned that i am an atheist to my fav teacher.she protested,my school protested,my parents protested and so do my best friends. why would anyone protest so much if they think that what they believe in is so divine and accepts all things? it is so hard being an atheist around here. will some of you help me,because i can't be forced to worship something that i belive doesn't exist.
hey seetha. i love you .if you accept that i will help youi to wade through these religious people . you always reject me,doesn't return my calls. ignores me. i am sure that if we talked sometimes you will also feel the connection . and let me say the first thing that we have in common. I AM AN ATHEIST. your friend and admiror, allvin.
hey kid, i am seetha's would-be -boyfriebnd. if you stalk her again i will blow your guts out. fuck offfffffffffff schmuck.
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