Should Pacquiao pursue a 154 lb. jr. middleweight title?
Manny "Pacman" Pacquiao currently faces a very tough challenge this November against WBO welterweight champion Miguel Angel Cotto of Puerto Rico; a fight that takes place at 145 lbs. If Pacquiao secures his seventh title in a seventh different weight class, he would be the first fighter in the history of boxing to accomplish such a feat.
The Filipino southpaw and Oscar de la Hoya, who has since retired, are currently the only six-time division champions. Floyd Mayweather, Jr., an active fighter, could also join the two in becoming a champion in six different weight classes should he pursue a belt at the junior middle weight division. This weight class has a limit of 154 lbs., directly above the crowded welterweight division, which has a limit of 147 lbs.
Related article: 2010 pound for pound landscape
Multi-Division Champions:
8 Division Champions:
None
7 Division Champion(s):
Manny Pacquiao (49-3-2) - pending a victory on November 14 against WBO champ Miguel Cotto
6 Division Champion(s):
Oscar de la Hoya (49-3-2) - retired
5 Division Champions:
Floyd Mayweather, Jr. (39-0) - active
Sugar Ray Leonard (36-3-1) - retired
Thomas Hearns (61-5-1) - retired
In a recent poll this week (see "2010 pound for pound landscape"), over 1,200 boxing fans voted (as of August 28th, 2009) and over 65%, or nearly 2 out of 3 voters, think that if (and let's emphasize "if") Manny Pacquiao were to beat the Puerto Rican Cotto for a seventh belt on November 14, that he should yet again move up in weight class and attempt to secure an eighth title belt in an eighth different weight class.
See: Belts are playoffs, P4P PPV equals real championship
The whirlwind 5'6" superstar started his career as a teenager in the 106 lb. weight division, and he admitted in a television interview with ESPN that he weighed a few pounds under this limit and carried metal rods in his pocket in order to make weight. Thus, Manny started his prize fighting journey weighing at around 100 lbs.
- Photos of Current Junior Middleweight Champions below -
Junior Middleweight Challenge, Anyone?
If he were to pursue this logic-defying route, the odds would be against his favor. Freddie Roach would have to select the right opponent lest he be accused of negligence. Pacquiao weighed in at 142 lbs. a day before his bout against the 5'10" Oscar de la Hoya in December, an opponent who fought Floyd Mayweather in 2007 at the 154 lb. limit. Manny would have to gain about 6 pounds to be within the junior middleweight range. He would only likely gain around 2 or 3 pounds, while his opponent, depending on who it would be, would have about 15+ pound weight advantage. Presumably, these bigger guys would also be slower than speed racer Pacman. And most would presume that the Filipino would hit and run and go for a decision victory.
Keys to Victory:
IBF champ Cory Spinks (37-5) is a fighter that would be tailor-made for Pacquiao's speed, power, and aggressive style. Pacman should have the best odds in his favor against the 5'9" Cory Spinks, who has a 71" reach compared to Pacquiao (5'6" and 67" reach). WBO champ and Ukranian Sergiy Dzinziruk would be too much of a risk. Dzinziruk has the capability to put a serious hurt on Manny, primarily because he would simply tower over at 6'0". He has a surprisingly short 68" reach. Pacman would have to keep away the whole fight, something that is inherently not in his nature.
WBC champ Sergio Martinez, WBA champ Daniel Santos, and especially WBO interim champ Paul Williams are giants in their weight class, and their combination of size, power, and snap would be excessively prohibitive. These fighters would simply be out of the question. Top Rank promoter Bob Arum will not risk serious injury for Manny by arranging a fight with them. The Argentinian Martinez is a big 5'11" veteran with a 76" reach, who makes Antonio Margarito look like a skinny kid. Daniel Santos is also a big 5'11" warrior with a 74" reach, and he is a thick fighter. Paul Williams is also out of the question; Williams is a top 10 pound for pound fighter in many rankings, and is fighting Kelly Pavlik at the 160 lb. middleweight division this November. He also has an incredible 82" reach which is longer than heavyweight champ Vladimir Klitschko's 81" reach.
IBF champion Cory Spinks (37-5) is Magic Number Eight?
That leaves Cory Spinks as the most desirable opponent out of this bunch, that is if you are a Manny Pacquiao fan and do not think that your idol has a death wish by fighting at 154 lbs. Spinks has been knocked down and TKO'd by former welterweight titlist Zab Judah before. While he could definitely put a serious hurt on Manny with his sheer power and size, he also tends to have "lazy gloves" in terms of punch output and defense. In his fight with Zab Judah in 2004 and 2005, Judah's snappy and quick lefts bothered Spinks which eventually took their toll. Manny's southpaw style and power hooks and lead lefts could inflict enough pain and cuts by the later rounds against a fighter with a style like Cory Spinks.
To be fair, many in the sports world and media would relegate such a matchup as unusually dangerous for the diminutive phenom, and may again attach a "Circus" label on the fight. Many would accuse Bob Arum and Freddie Roach as discarding legitimate health concerns for their famous client. As the highlight video shows, Spinks has enough pop to significantly stagger or knock out Manny. If a 130 lb. super featherweight Juan Manuel Marquez can stagger Manny, as he did in their second fight in 2008, it would be reasonable to argue that Spinks can outright TKO Pacquiao. However, Spinks is actually shorter than de la Hoya, who Manny retired this year after a brutal beating from ring post to ring post.
The question would be: is this historic audacity or Kamikaze suicide mission? You be the judge.
Why Do It?
On the flip side, many of Pacquiao's international and Filipino fans would want their idol to secure an astounding eighth belt in an eight different weight division. If Manny beats Cotto for the title, and such a fight is arranged at 154 lbs., Pacquiao would be leaving behind a blazing trail for the history books - not just in boxing, but in the scrolled annals of sports in general. The other earth-shattering fight in 2010 would presumably be against the winner of Mayweather vs. Marquez. As 2011 rolls around, boxing's most exciting weight class for years to come could very well be the junior middleweight and middleweight divisions, whose excitement and revenues could at least display bursts of competitiveness with the UFC. By 2011, the division could sport boxing's next pound-for-pound king in Paul Williams. Perhaps Shane Mosley and Floyd Mayweather would move up to 154 lbs. Kelly Pavlik could find several worthy challengers to his middleweight throne, and Mexican Antonio Margarito would be back by then. Undefeated German "King" Arthur Abraham could step down a weight class or two and claim his territory, and so could undefeated and regarded Brit Carl Froch be in the mix. And Jermain Taylor can present any of these warriors with a tough challenge.
The junior welters can surely set up many interesting fights in 2010. In this crowded pool there are several fighters: Juan Diaz, Paulie Malignaggi, Ricky Hatton, Amir Khan, Marco Antonio Barrera, David Diaz, Timothy Bradley, Nate Campbell, Victor Ortiz, and Juan Manuel Marquez. Mexican great Erik Morales also intends to return to boxing.
See: Top 7 remaining fights of 2009 and decade
If Manny Pacquiao fights at 154 lbs., many would view the move as utterly crazy, to be sure. ESPN would fan the flames of controversy, night after night, arguing against the unnecessary health risks for a fighter who has already secured his legacy. Boxing is perhaps the most dangerous sport in the world (not counting the Extreme Sports genre).
See: Boxing fatalities and economics: determination or deathwish?
If the 154 lb. challenge does transpire, Pacquiao would have an opportunity to bring boxing's sizzle and flash to the sport's next focus area in terms of weight division, as Pacman permanently retires from the ring for good.
Manny Pacquiao's Retirement
The sad truth is, it appears that Manny Pacquiao permanently retire from boxing in 2010. He is walking away from the sport, never to be seen inside the ring, ever again. Manny started his childhood in General Santos City not having much to eat, perhaps having one meal a day mostly consisting of rice. Within young Manny's life, it has been reported that on more than several occasions, he had to fight nature's bare and brutish elements by sleeping in nothing more than a cardboard box - a testimony to the cruel realities of many portions of our world. This warrior sprouted from a forgotten corner, and through a heroic journey conquered impossible trials and adversity.
Does the 154 lb. challenge represent that final impossible challenge, that most audacious of risks? That death-defying leap of faith that caps an already improbable career?
The resounding calls for all-time status would reverberate once again, echoing in the halls of the sport . . .
For now, November 14 inches closer - the earth begins to shake to the drumbeat as Miguel Cotto arrives at the gates of Blood, Hell and Fury . . .
Sergiy Dzinziruk video highlights
Daniel Santos video highlights
Sergio Martinez video highlights
Paul Williams video highlights
"Our real problem, then, is not our strength today; it is rather the vital necessity of action today to ensure our strength tomorrow." - Dwight D. Eisenhower
Other Notes: HBO's 24/7 coverage of the Mayweather vs. Marquez premieres this Saturday night, August 29.
Subscribe to Marv Dumon's Boxing Articles using 'Subscribe' button at top of page.
Copyright 2009. Marv Dumon. May not be republished without author's written consent
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Comments
yes ... manny can why not in fact they want manny because there is a big money on it and you cannot deny it my friends...
Everything in this world is possible...
Look at golden boy dela hoya as to what happen during there ...
Manny easily manhandled this man and there is no reason why he cannot do it again to others who wants to fight him...
They are all a very easy opponent of PACMAN...
corrections PBF won the WBC 154 title when he beat ODLH. He needs to go to 160 to get a 6 title.
Pcaman vs. Pavlik. Get it on!
Too early to call 154 lbs for Pacquiao. First he should focus on his upcoming fight with Cotto.If he is successful(w/c I believe)
then he will be the only boxer to win 7 titles in as many weight classes. During his younger days he captured the WBC flyweight
title in 1999, months after that his body begun to amass and could not make the 112 limit. The crown was stripped from him day before he defend his title for the 2nd time and eventually loss due to dehydration.
He then moved on to win world titles in Superbantamweight, Featherweight, Superfeatherweight, Lightweight and Jr. Welterweight. Take note that if he was properly managed before, he should have won titles from Superflyweight and Bantamweight. If it did happen, he should have been holding 8/8 now. If he is lucky come Nov 14, then I think better for him to try the 154 lbs challenge before he retire. Forget about Mayweather. He got nothing to prove against this guy and Marquez too.
Correction DSource. Floyd has 5 world titles in as many divisions and one of those is at 154 lbs. He won titles at 130, 135, 140, 147 and 154... He won the WBC 154 title from Oscar dela Hoya... He needs to be a middleweight champion to join Manny and Oscar... And if Manny wins against Cotto, Floyd may need to move up to 168 lbs to win 7 titles to chase Manny...
corrections PBF won the WBC 154 title when he beat ODLH. He needs to go to 160 to get a 6 title.
Hey! I got this idea! Why not suggest shane mosely to go for a title fight on junior middleweight champ cory spinks and if he wins he can surely call on pacman for a historic 8th title belt. For sure pacman will put him on top of his list this time! that is after pacman destroy welterweight champ miguel cotto! What you think BOB, Freddie or Shane! nice idea?
that will be mind boggling man! 8th belt/title for Pacman.. I guess you are right pfineman; the only way for Mosley to get Pacmans attention is to have something in the table to make it happen! junior middleweight is possible since Mosley can switch from 147 to 154 and even challenge Pacman to a catchweight around the 140's... Great suggestion you got there; I hope everything will fall into place for this event to happen. Forget Mayweather, he is a hoax! Go Mosley for junior middle weight champ and Pacman will come following you!!!
pfineman, i think its still premature to pit pacquiao among the junior middleweight champ. He still needs to overcome the very difficult challenge in welterweight champ m.cotto! But the mere idea of this happenning is like tiger woods trying to eclipse sam snead almost impossible PGA record 82 wins and jack niclaus 18 Majors! Only that boxing is more physically competitive and you don't do more than 3 major fights a year plus the fact every weight category you enter means a more insurmountable feat to position yourself to be dominant or better still be its lineal champion!From 106lbs to 145lbs and still beating the crap out of bigger fighters! That is how manny pacquiao is dominating the sports!
Manny is the man, but not at 154.
ringside-news.com
THATS HOW DESPERATE ODLH TRIED GETTING PACMAN TO HIS STABLE! ALL HE HAS NOW ARE FIGHTERS PACMAN IS DEMOLISHING ONE AFTER ANOTHER! I SEE A POSSIBILITY ODLH MAY POSITION MOSLEY FOR A JUNIOR MIDDLEWEIGHT TITLE FIGHT TO GET PACMAN'S NOD NEXT EVEN IF MAYWEATHER WINS OVER JMM. HE "MUST" GET A SHOT TO ANOTHER BLOCKBUSTER FIGHT AND HIS ONLY HOPE IS MOSLEY VS PACMAN (WITH THE 154 TITLE)! COTTO, JMM AND MAYWEATHER(WHATEVER THE OUTCOME COME SEPT. 19) WILL JUST PICK UP THE CRUMBS!
Manny has that monkey blood in him, a fighter like him is heavily expected to demolish an opponent.
If Pacman wins over cotto, forget who wins sept.19 fraud fight! A junior middleweight fighter willing to fight at a catch weight between 148-150 will still make it a title fight at junior middleweight! Among the contenders witha possible blockbuster appeal is corey spinks but if some suggets mosley tries to get a junior middleweight belt first then challenge pacman at a catchweight that will be AAAAWWWWEEEESSSSOOOOMMMMEEEE!!!!!
I don't want manny to go up in anymore division going north. Is kind of silly. I would love to see manny fight, Mayweather, Mosely, Margarito. And if he wins all three, he is one of the all time great. And if he wants to fight one more. Paul Williams at junior Middleweight will solidify him as the ATG
Klitscko vs. Pacman. Klitscko will go down to 154 lbs to fight Manny for the middleweight title fight. I'd love to see Klitscko at 154 pounds. Manny by decision.
if pacman goes to 154 it'll be a catchweight for sure. 150lbs LOL, AND he'll surely fight a Top Rank fighter cuz of Arum. Arum will find a way to give Chavez Jr a belt and make him fight Pacquiao for a catchweight for the jr middlweight belt. Easy peasy. Money talks bullsh1t walks.
I think it's more plausible for PACMAN to fight JMM @ 135 for the lineal and alphabet soup belt. Getting him to 154 is a big risk than 135.
also, getting another lineal title belt will guarantee him a top 5 p4p for all time. That should be hyped up rather than 154!
i don't think ugly floyd would climb to 160 to win his 6th title... he'd rather step back to featherweight to fight small champios that he he really used to do.. picking smaller opponents.. that's the real ugly floyd..
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dont be over confident on pacquiao... havent you heard? he is still not answering freddie's call on where to train... i hope pacquiao loses if he wish to train in baguio... cotto already trained ahead of time....
Don't get over-excited for pacquaio winning the 7th division. I'll bet my house he'll lose the fight, the stupid guy is still busy making the movie. No matter how he tries, he's still a lousy actor.
JUNIOR MIDDLEWEIGHTS,154 FOR PACQUIAO? WHY NOT JUST SHOOT HIM IN THE HEAD?
if manny is gonna fight at 154lb then for sure it would be another "catchweight" title and arum and roach would go for cory spinks the weakest of all other title holders spinks cant punch and is all defensive, doesnt even try to hurt his opponents just out box them and move all day, dont believe me then watch his fights
www.youtube.com/watch?v=LTe1dsW3aC8&feature=related
HELL NO! 154 is too much for PAC. His legacy is established at 147. High risk low reward.
Let's not talk about the 154 trip for Pacquiao. Cotto is still a live opponent and as such should not be treated lightly. The 7th is still up for grabs.
To Mr.Marv Dumon, for you information, Floyd is a 5 division champ with belts at Super Featherweight, Lightweight, Jr. Welterweight, Welterweight and yes--154 lb division Jr. Middleweight which he took from the Golden goose. In order for Floyd to gain his 6th division title, he needs to fight Middleweight champ Kelly Pavlik.
Regards,
Mike DC
thank marv jumong
Wag na kayong mangarap sa 154 lbs, Dahil siguradong talo na sya kay Cotto, Cotto will be too strong and too slick for Pacquiao.
Zab Judah said that he's sure Arum will lose no sleep if Miguel Cotto beats Pacman on Nov. 14 since he has both under his Top Rank promotional tent."Arum wants Cotto to win and he will. Arum has Cotto in New York, in Madison Square Garden every June in connection with the Puerto Rican Day Parade and they draw 19,000 people. Why would Arum want to give that up? Pacquaio can't draw people like that." Looking back at this, this makes sense because Pacquiao will soon retire while Bob Arum will renew Cotto´s contract if he wins over Manny before end of this year.
No wonder why Bob Arum is not pushing Pacquiao to have early training while he is constantly talking with Pacquiao´s canadian lawyer Koncz. I hope Team Pacquiao will wake up soon enough and get in touch with Freddie Roach, I think he is the only who is really concern about Pacquiao´s future.
manny will knock down cotto swear! hehe i believe him!!
All boxers have their limits and Manny Pac is no superman. To invade the 154 weight category is too risky for Pacman. For me it doesn't make sense at all. Just take the best boxers in the welterweight division like Floyd and that's it. What more does a person need to prove that he's an all time great? He is already one of the great boxers who ever live and that's the bottom line.
It's just too early to talk about this(154 lb challenge)right now..
Manny already have too many distractions(shooting movies,TV sitcoms,politics)etc..I hope they could come up with the best training site far away from these distractions...
Manny needs to fully-focus on his fight with Cotto(He's a very dangerous fighter)...
If Manny wins,then I believe that there's no other meaningful fight for him than a MEGA FIGHT with the Winner of the Mayweather-Marquez fight..Peace Bros...
Fighting at the higher division with a chosen underdog champion or in a catchweight or anything that is not in the usual weight on the fight night will just leave boxing fans double-minded regarding his supremacy. Let him fight the best of the best in the division. That's the real meaning of All-Time Great.
Manny at the moment had too many distractions. All of them would definitely would bring him down the drain after November 14, 2009. Just like what happened to Hatton. Manny right now is overconfident against Coto. People surrounding him are nuisance and not doing him any good. Eight weeks of training is not enough to beat Coto. Manny's attitude against Coto is a losing proposition. Mark my words.
that's it pacman don't even think about it. 7th is enough, enjoy your fame, money and your family you entertained us enough already.don't even think about politics either just give the best education for your children to take care of your money and is their money too.
Keep on gettin ahead of yourselfs...... Now Manny is gonna go up 2 Jr. Middleweight. Smh. You people are a joke. He's not gonna beat Cotto so I don't even care what he does after he loses in Nov. & De La Hoya shouldn't even be a hall of famer in my opinion. Ok he should but c'mon man he lost all of his biggest fights. He wasn't a clutch fighter. No cojones what so ever.
Bukol is the Man!!!!! He's right. Go Cotto.
Chakyun 2. He's speakin the truth. I like u guys...... & by the way UFC 102 is gonna suck.
Baby siomai how can u say his legacy is secure at 147 yea he fought de la hoya at 147 but it was a catch weight other than that he hasn't fought a living sole at 147 and the last I check u can't claim nothing if you never been there.... I love how all these pac fans think cotto is sweet..cotto face opponents Who has way more power than him margarito (plaster or not) and clottey and I dare y'all to say otherwise he been in the ring with fighters who had better hand speed than him mosley judah and was able to neutralize their speed with his counter punching abilities his ability to cut off a ring is amazing watch the clottey fight the 6th rd I think when cotto trapped him and pummeled him the whole rd if pac get trapped like that its lights out for him I'm sure of it.. cuz pac has tendacies to get trapped in corners jmm had him but failed cause he didn't keep proper distance when he trapped him
first of all, for those who didnt know this is the 1st catch weight pacman will ever fight, with cotto. dela hoya asked pacquiao to go up 147 he said yes, but not a catch weight there was no disagreement there dela hoya called all the shots as he always do.
2nd pacquiao needs to go to mexico and train at that high elevation GYM forgot the name. he needs to stop filim his crapy movies, and start training for his big fight. he's not taking cotto seriously this fight is suppose to secure his legacy.
Hey Dennis... Mayweather already became a junior middleweight champion when he outpointed dela hoya back in 07.. that's why he became a 5 division champion (130, 135, 140, 147 and 154)
The only way he can get a sixth one is if he fights as a middleweight
manny train in mexico. then beat cotto, marquez, mosley, mayweather and spinks..then run for presidency in the Philippines.
Manny at 154 has little reward and alot of risk. I really don't care to see manny in a division where the most well known guys are dead(RIP Vernon) not champions(angulo) or in jail (kirkland). If he beats cotto all the fights and money are still at welter...unless Marquez pulls upset the JJM vs Pac-man III at 140 is the fight I would want.
Manny fights for the Filipinos and the Philippines, not for history or anything else. I want my hero to be safe always. He's more for us than what he thinks he's done. If her wins against Cotto, I hope he'll stay in the Welterweight division at most.
I know Manny can handle Miguel C. if he's focus and serious. But still, Cotto gives me the creeps. He's too big for Manny to fight everyday.
Didn't you notice that you posted the only fighters to win 6 division titles have the same record of win-loss-draw as of today if that is true, what an amazing coincidence, another record to be broken?. Maybe if Pacquiao goes after Cory Spinks all assumptions you have made would have been applied when pacquiao made his title runs.
Another thing that intrigues me is the selection of Shawn Porter who is a jr. middleweight as sparmate. I believe that Porter's weight is even beyond middleweight right now since, he is not scheduled to fight. Is this an indication or feeler if Pacquiao can take the punch of a jr. middleweight or if porter weighs more even a middleweight? What do you think? I've previously commented that if Mayweather doesn't want to fight maybe Pacquiao should go after Spinks to further cement his legacy and now Im reading your article on the possibility of Pacquiao going for an eight title. Lol
I agree that Manny Pacquiao such stay in welter weight of junior welterweight. Better fight Floyd Mayweather which everybody is itching about (maybe because they want to see Manny beat the hell-out of Floyd and give Floyd is first unbearable lost. :D) Then after he can make a fight with JMM for the Third Time and beat him like what he did with Hatton. Lastly, maybe he can entertain the Pacquiao-Hatton rematch so that Hatton can redeem himself (or get beaten again... hmmm very sour...). I think that Manny should just go for the 7th title and afterwhich enjoy the welterweight division. Regards to all.
that would be the ultimate if he fights and win the 154 lbs title. but first thing first, beat cotto, mayweather, mosley and marquez first in that order and hopefully chavez jr. is the new light middle champ by that time. bob arum can stage that fight in 2011. congressman manny is just 33 by that time and still on his prime.
Pac will embarrass Cotto on Nov 14. And all you negative azzholes that think pac is not serious or not training hard enough dont know zhit behind your keyboards whacking away. Jeff the Moron that said Dela Hoya should not be in the hall of fame should just shot himself he definitely dont know boxing. The Man has 10 World Titles. Just getting 1 is very hard idiot. Over 95% of the fighters never achieve that goal. JEFF YOU JUST SHOWN HOW REALLY STUPID YOU ARE. ItS an insult too a retard to call you a retard.
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